Cleric Race?

[guido1999]

Shaundakul...yes, Air Genasi are fitting clerics of him.

 

[kreynolds]

Shaundakul...

That's the one!

 

[Christian]

I've used Cha as a dump stat for my cleric. If you're making a melee cleric, that enhances his fighting with spells, there's no need for a high charisma. At least I haven't needed it in 11 levels. Turning is the only use for it, and you can do that with a bit of luck and cha 8!

Out party's cleric has an 8 charisma, and I have to say that it gets irritating sometimes. Not so much the penalty to the turning rolls, but to the turning checks per day. A cleric with a 14 charisma gets more than twice as many checks per day as a cleric with an 8 charisma, so not only does he miss less often, but he gets more retries if he does miss.

I guess it's more evident when there are more opportunities. This cleric has the Earth domain, so besides undead, he can turn/destroy air elementals and rebuke/control earth elementals. (We could have had that earth elemental helping us out for the rest of the adventure, but no! We had to hack it up instead. )

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

Turn Undead is also useful for Divine Might, which is one of my favorite feats for any Cleric or Paladin. That's why these classes should have a high Charisma, in my opinion.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Turn Undead is also useful for Divine Might, which is one of my favorite feats for any Cleric or Paladin. That's why these classes should have a high Charisma, in my opinion.

14 turn attempts to power a +11 Divine Might or Divine Shield that you can Share with your Dire Lion mount (with Animated Shield) is nice

-Hyp.

 

[danielinthwolvesden]

You know, I tried that "fighting cleric" bit. Got a cleric with a Str of 20, and a CHA or 8. But here's the point. About 7th level, your spellcasting gets better & better, and the "real" fighters in the party start to outshine you by a LOT. I think he was a mistake, myself. Several other cool feats, spells & such depend upon the cleric's charisma. I use Dex for the dump, with only a 10. In a small party, with no real fighter, maybe.

Several sprites would make a good cleric, with bonuses to CHA & WIS.

But even tho I admit that Aasimar is an option, that level hit you take is not worth it with a cleric. If it is a point based system, and with few points- then OK, yes, maybe an Aasimar. But being a level behind in a spellcaster class is never a good thing.

Do a human. Maybe pick up one of the races of humans in Faerun to add some colour.

 

[Particle_Man]

Well, if you want the CHR cleric, I would suggest the Kalamar Player's Guide (which, IMHO, is not munchkin except for one feat I don't like), and take the forest gnome. Yes, they lose 2 str, but gain 2 wis and 2 chr, plus have a racial bonus of +2 to diplomacy (if your cleric is to convert people, or be the face of the party, this can come in handy). They also have the gnome AC bonus vs. various monsters that most gnomes get.

I guess it depends on what sort of cleric you are going for.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

take the forest gnome. Yes, they lose 2 str, but gain 2 wis and 2 chr, plus have a racial bonus of +2 to diplomacy

Hm... -2 Str but +2 Wis AND +2 Cha. That isn't only unbalanced, but the -2 Str will mean nothing to a spell-oriented cleric.

Without an ECL +1, that surely is overpowered.

You know, I tried that "fighting cleric" bit. Got a cleric with a Str of 20, and a CHA or 8. But here's the point. About 7th level, your spellcasting gets better & better, and the "real" fighters in the party start to outshine you by a LOT.

I disagree. They may still be better in melee or with ranged weapons, but not a lot. Not with spells like divine favor, divine power, greater magic weapon and all the other buff spells (and if you make divine power and divine favor persistant, it gets really scary) Remember that the cleric will have much better will saves (one of the fighters biggest disadvantages) and the bonus of being a full spellcaster, with a spell list including spells to heal more than just the couple of HP you get with a potion....

Sure, the cleric is there to support the party, but he can survive on his own if he has to, while the fighter will get to his bounderies very fast.

 

[Particle_Man]

Hm... -2 Str but +2 Wis AND +2 Cha. That isn't only unbalanced, but the -2 Str will mean nothing to a spell-oriented cleric.

Without an ECL +1, that surely is overpowered.

Then I assume you are in the camp that thinks that the half-orc is underpowered for gaining +2 STR and -2 to INT and CHR? The idea that one can trade strength for two mental abilities already has precedent in the core books.

Every race is better at some classes than at others. Halflings make better "skill oriented" rogues, for example. That by itself does not make a race over-powered. So the fact that one race is better at being a "spell-oriented" cleric, but worse at being a "hack n slash" fighter does not make that race overpowered. Indeed, the whole point of this thread was to find races that were better for the cleric class.

I think the Forest Gnome is about right at +0 ECL.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

Then I assume you are in the camp that thinks that the half-orc is underpowered for gaining +2 STR and -2 to INT and CHR? The idea that one can trade strength for two mental abilities already has precedent in the core books.

Trading two mental abilities for strength isn't the same thing as trading strength for two mental abilities. To use an analogy, I can take an old car and 20,000 dollars to a dealership and get a new car for that. I can't take a new car to a dealership and get an old car and 20,000 dollars for it.

Penalties have to be weighed differently than bonusses. Gaining strength is generally more advantageous than gaining other attributes. It doesn't follow, however, that losing strength is more disadvantageous than losing other attributes. (If you were looking for a penalty that would justify unbalanced bonusses, it should be con not strength). Consequently, I think that +2 str has to be balanced by more penalties but -2 strength doesn't justify more bonusses.

Every race is better at some classes than at others. Halflings make better "skill oriented" rogues, for example. That by itself does not make a race over-powered. So the fact that one race is better at being a "spell-oriented" cleric, but worse at being a "hack n slash" fighter does not make that race overpowered. Indeed, the whole point of this thread was to find races that were better for the cleric class.

It's true that some races are better at some class concepts. That doesn't make them broken. On the other hand, if they are significantly better, that does make them broken. The Codex Arcanis for Paradigm concept's campaign setting has the Ardakene race that gives +2 dex, wis, cha for -2 str and con (with favored class cleric to boot). That race is ideally suited for a spell-oriented cleric (truth to be told, it's ideally suited for a lot of classes). I happen to think that it's broken. It's too well suited for that class.