Code Monkey Lose WoTC License (Merged)

[2WS-Steve]

Has anyone considered what it means that CMP lost the WotC license *and* that Fluid announced that they are selling (sold?) their stake in Dundjinni?

Coincidence? Or has Fluid been tapped to do something for WotC in the near future that will involve online or electronic player and DM tools?

My suspicion is that this indicates that companies with too strong a fondness for Java driven apps find themselves going out of business.

 

[rom90125]

My suspicion is that this indicates that companies with too strong a fondness for Java driven apps find themselves going out of business.

LOL.. C# and the .NET platform all the way....

 

[Mercule]

This, by itself, is highly unimpressive. I have somewhere around 150 NPc's built through E-Tools on my PC. They'll have to up the ante considerably for this to be a replacement for any of the tools out there. Let's hope they'll have something more powerful for offline use.

Agreed. I'm not even remotely interested in an online character generator. Heck, one of my players does his chargen on a PC w/o Internet access.

What are my minimum requirements?
- customizable -- I muck with the rules a lot. If I can't jack with the datasets and hand them out to my players, forget it. This includes things like adding/deleting classes, feats, skills, and spells as well as spell points, armor as DR, and other oddball bits.

- multicampaign support -- We have multiple GMs, sometimes with multiple campaigns each. And each campaign has a different set of rules, depending on setting, DM, and theme.

- localized -- I want my custom datasets under my control.

- monster data -- I advance monsters a lot. 'Nough said.

- combat tracker -- I've lived w/o one. Never again.

PCGen is the only app that I've found that does that. Sure, it's got some warts, but it's still well beyond anything I've found.

If WotC can do better, then I'll happily pay money for their product. If not, then I won't. If they intend to make an online generator to be the only "authorized" source, then I hope it fails badly. Honestly, the idea ticks me off.

 

[3catcircus]

Agreed. I'm not even remotely interested in an online character generator. Heck, one of my players does his chargen on a PC w/o Internet access.

What are my minimum requirements?
- customizable -- I muck with the rules a lot. If I can't jack with the datasets and hand them out to my players, forget it. This includes things like adding/deleting classes, feats, skills, and spells as well as spell points, armor as DR, and other oddball bits.

- multicampaign support -- We have multiple GMs, sometimes with multiple campaigns each. And each campaign has a different set of rules, depending on setting, DM, and theme.

- localized -- I want my custom datasets under my control.

- monster data -- I advance monsters a lot. 'Nough said.

- combat tracker -- I've lived w/o one. Never again.

PCGen is the only app that I've found that does that. Sure, it's got some warts, but it's still well beyond anything I've found.

If WotC can do better, then I'll happily pay money for their product. If not, then I won't. If they intend to make an online generator to be the only "authorized" source, then I hope it fails badly. Honestly, the idea ticks me off.

I used to use PCGen until I found DMGenie. *Yes* it costs some $$ to get the thing, but you get full functionality in a (30?) day trial. I buy very few things (I'm still using Winzip with the nag screens), but I bought this 3 days after trying it out.

Customizable: Check. Add, remove, change things. The only caveat is that as newer data becomes available, DMGenie may need to be modified by the developer (i.e. Ardent Mantles aren't yet accounted for - if I were doing development, I'd treat them like Cleric Domains).

Multiple campaign support: Check. You can make multiple campaigns, export campaigns, adventures, etc.

Localized: Check - other than the SRD stuff, you control what goes into the datasets unless you want to find and download datasets put together by other users.

Monster Data: Check - add monster levels, add class levels, treat any monster like a PC race and give 'em levels in any class.

Combat Tracker: Check. I was looking solely for an initiative tracker when I went searching for electronic tools. DMGenie allows you to add various combatants (friendlies and enemies), give them automatic or manually rolled inititives, attacks, and damages, activate feats, spells, powers, etc (i.e. the party wizard casts Haste and the party is affected appropriately.)

Did I mention that other than the initial start-up that could take a few seconds (to load all that data, especially when you've included the entire T1-4, A1-4, or GDQ1-7 adventures, with all of the text, statted out monsters, and treasures, for example), the thing runs *extremely* quickly. The only caveat being that the auto-save feature may slow you down a few seconds in the middle of a battle.

Did I also mention the exportable combat log?

No, I'm not shilling for DMGenie, I just think that it is *that* good, and it has the potential to be even better if it had all of the WotC data available to support it.

Until something better come along, I'll happily use DMGenie, even though it sucks to have to experiment with and code VB scripts for feats, spells, and class abilities for new data you add (VB scripts are how you get the feats, spells, etc. to act upon the subject in DMGenie - i.e. - the spell data is entered and available, but you have to code a script to get it to act on the PCs or NPCs.)

 

[DonTadow]

I used to use PCGen until I found DMGenie. *Yes* it costs some $$ to get the thing, but you get full functionality in a (30?) day trial. I buy very few things (I'm still using Winzip with the nag screens), but I bought this 3 days after trying it out.

Customizable: Check. Add, remove, change things. The only caveat is that as newer data becomes available, DMGenie may need to be modified by the developer (i.e. Ardent Mantles aren't yet accounted for - if I were doing development, I'd treat them like Cleric Domains).

Multiple campaign support: Check. You can make multiple campaigns, export campaigns, adventures, etc.

Localized: Check - other than the SRD stuff, you control what goes into the datasets unless you want to find and download datasets put together by other users.

Monster Data: Check - add monster levels, add class levels, treat any monster like a PC race and give 'em levels in any class.

Combat Tracker: Check. I was looking solely for an initiative tracker when I went searching for electronic tools. DMGenie allows you to add various combatants (friendlies and enemies), give them automatic or manually rolled inititives, attacks, and damages, activate feats, spells, powers, etc (i.e. the party wizard casts Haste and the party is affected appropriately.)

Did I mention that other than the initial start-up that could take a few seconds (to load all that data, especially when you've included the entire T1-4, A1-4, or GDQ1-7 adventures, with all of the text, statted out monsters, and treasures, for example), the thing runs *extremely* quickly. The only caveat being that the auto-save feature may slow you down a few seconds in the middle of a battle.

Did I also mention the exportable combat log?

No, I'm not shilling for DMGenie, I just think that it is *that* good, and it has the potential to be even better if it had all of the WotC data available to support it.

Until something better come along, I'll happily use DMGenie, even though it sucks to have to experiment with and code VB scripts for feats, spells, and class abilities for new data you add (VB scripts are how you get the feats, spells, etc. to act upon the subject in DMGenie - i.e. - the spell data is entered and available, but you have to code a script to get it to act on the PCs or NPCs.)

Same thing happened to me a few years ago. DMGenie was visually more appealing and had a lot of crunch stuff i needed for notetaking, treasures and tracking. Then its programable which makes it just as good. I can copy pdf monster and npc statblocks and paste them in with no problem, whereas with pcgen i either had to wait for someone else to do it or rewrite/type stuff.

 

[buzz]

Let's hope they'll have something more powerful for offline use.

Let's also hope that it's something WotC has developed with an eye towards using it in-house, as it's pretty obvious from the error rate in their published stat blocks that they desperately need a solid software tool. Of course, this probably isn't the case. On top of that, anything they release will likely be Windows-only anyway (which does me no good until such time as I get an Intel Mac).

The D&D Character Builder seems to have no selling point I can see other than integration with the Virtual Gaming Table thing, and the latter is of absolutely no use to me.

There used to be a site we used in the early days of 3.0 that was basically what WotC is describing: an online character record database. It was a PITA that we gladly ditched. With Yahoo and Google offering free mailing lists with disk storage, who needs what WotC is offering? I don't get it.

 

[3catcircus]

Let's also hope that it's something WotC has developed with an eye towards using it in-house, as it's pretty obvious from the error rate in their published stat blocks that they desperately need a solid software tool. Of course, this probably isn't the case. On top of that, anything they release will likely be Windows-only anyway (which does me no good until such time as I get an Intel Mac).

The D&D Character Builder seems to have no selling point I can see other than integration with the Virtual Gaming Table thing, and the latter is of absolutely no use to me.

There used to be a site we used in the early days of 3.0 that was basically what WotC is describing: an online character record database. It was a PITA that we gladly ditched. With Yahoo and Google offering free mailing lists with disk storage, who needs what WotC is offering? I don't get it.

I'm not sure that what you are describing is what they plan on offering. It sounds like a combination of PCGen, DMGenie, Campaign Suite, etc. with possibly WebRPG/OpenRPG type tools.

Unless you are a DM of a 3.x game, then you *won't* see the value in a "virtual gaming table" - try keeping track of feats, spells, class abilities, etc. for the NPCs by hand - anything over 3 or 4 NPCs and it becomes a chore. Likewise, just *statting* up an adventure is an exercise in pain. In 1st/2nd edition, if I wanted a "Dwarf Ftr 6, AC 6, longsword +2, +1 to hit/dmg (Str)" then that was enough information. *Now*. I gotta know what feats he has taken, full attributes, specific armor worn, how many skill points in relevant skills, etc.)

*I* didn't put much stock in this idea until I started using various electronic tools - my workload has gone down (in most cases) and my enjoyment has gone up.

 

[buzz]

I'm not sure that what you are describing is what they plan on offering. It sounds like a combination of PCGen, DMGenie, Campaign Suite, etc. with possibly WebRPG/OpenRPG type tools.

I was responding to KC's, "Let's hope they'll have something more powerful for offline use."

Unless you are a DM of a 3.x game, then you *won't* see the value in a "virtual gaming table"...

*I* didn't put much stock in this idea until I started using various electronic tools - my workload has gone down (in most cases) and my enjoyment has gone up.

3c, I don't think this is what they're advertising. The Virtual Gaming Table is a tool for playing D&D via the 'Net, like WebRPG or Kloogewerks. It's not a DM'ing aid. Unless your group is going to sit around the table with laptops, and you have a LAN, I don't see what use this is going to be for FtF play.

I'm also one of the DMs that rotate in my regular groups, and none of us have yet felt the need for PCs at the table. The number-crunching I need my computer for is generally pre-game.

 

[Ranger REG]

Has anyone considered what it means that CMP lost the WotC license *and* that Fluid announced that they are selling (sold?) their stake in Dundjinni?

Coincidence? Or has Fluid been tapped to do something for WotC in the near future that will involve online or electronic player and DM tools?

They're going to rescan miniatures and record sound bites again???

 

[kingpaul]

the interface and design choices they made rendered the software highly suboptimal for us.

Well, eTools was initially created by Fluid, CMP inherited it. PCGen is an open-source project, CMP just does datasets for it.