Combat Reflexes and a double weapon

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

That's correct and is what I said above.

Although I'd be interested in seeing the rules-quote you have to back that up.

 

[Infiniti2000]

It's in the two-weapon fighting section. When you attack with two-weapons, you get certain penalties. For example, "You suffer a -6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand ...." Nothing restricts that penalty for only during your action. If it did, you could have some odd cases, such as getting the penalty on AoO made during your action and not getting the penalty when it wasn't your action.

 

[Darklone]

Right. Not to be confused with Dual Strike from CV, which allows you to make an attack with both weapons as a standard action.

CV ?

 

[Krelios]

CV ?

The accepted abbreviation for Complete Adventurer... CA was already taken by Complete Arcane.

 

[Darklone]

Thanks, I'm getting old.

 

[Bauglir]

That's not defined anywhere, unfortunately. You could have just as much rules basis saying it's a move action as you would a free action (i.e. both being houserules). If you say it's a move action (like I believe the FAQ does), then you should just treat it like drawing a weapon (i.e. quick draw applies and you can do it while moving if you have a BAB of +1 or higher).

Yeah you're probably right; I was thinking that adjusting your grip on a weapon would be a fairly trivial movement in the flow of combat, as compared to drawing a weapon. Maybe not quite trivial enough to merit a free action though.

This definitely cannot happen, regardless of whether you make adjusting your grip a free action. The point is that you cannot take actions on your AoO. Now, perhaps you could always 'shift' to a two-handed weapon stance after every action you take so you're always 'ready' for attacks of opportunity, but that just points out the cheese in the free action shift weapon houserule. You can curb this by saying that you can only shift hands prior to attacking, not afterwards. Then, it's reasonable.

Well the method's a bit cheesy, but I don't see any harm in a double-weapon weilder getting 2-handed AoOs, at the cost of a feat (Quickdraw) to do it.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

It's in the two-weapon fighting section.

Really? That's where it says that the penalty applies until your next action?

To get right down to it, it doesn't specifically say that the penalties apply until your next action. It also doesn't specifically say that the penalties do not apply until your next action. Note the difference in text from Flurry of Blows, which specifically calls out that the penalties apply until your next action.

Rather, the TWF penalties apply "when fighting this way."

Define "when fighting this way," and you'll know when the penalties apply.

Note that there are two, equally valid by the RAW, definitions of "fighting this way."

 

[Bauglir]

Really? That's where it says that the penalty applies until your next action?

To get right down to it, it doesn't specifically say that the penalties apply until your next action. It also doesn't specifically say that the penalties do not apply until your next action. Note the difference in text from Flurry of Blows, which specifically calls out that the penalties apply until your next action.

Rather, the TWF penalties apply "when fighting this way."

Define "when fighting this way," and you'll know when the penalties apply.

Note that there are two, equally valid by the RAW, definitions of "fighting this way."

Yeah this was pretty much my view on things. I find this interpretation to be reasonably consistent and balanced in play.

Does it count as a house rule when the RAW aren't specific on the matter?

 

[Infiniti2000]

Really? That's where it says that the penalty applies until your next action?

Right, and fighting 'this way' (i.e. TWF) is a full round action. You get those penalties during that time period. How long is a full round action? Well, "A full-round action requires an entire round to complete." And, what exactly does this mean? Well, "For almost all purposes, there is no relevance to the end of a round or the beginning of a round. A round can be a segment of game time starting with the first character to act and ending with the last, but it usually means a span of time from one round to the same initiative count in the next round."

Fwiw, I agree it's not absolutely clear like the wording in, say, power attack, but the rules I've quoted strongly favor my view with a preponderance of evidence. In fact, there are no actual counterarguments actually favoring the other view.

 

[werk]

SRD-AoO-Making an AoO
You make your attack of opportunity, however, at your normal attack bonus—even if you’ve already attacked in the round.

Does that trump any penalties for fighting style? I think it is only in there to offset the -5 penalty on iterative attacks. Looking at power attack and flurry, it looks like your 'normal attack bonus' is what you used during your turn...which I would say includes wield style for double weapons or penalties for TWF.