Complete Adventurer - sounds good

[Tuzenbach]

MerricB, I'm curious...are there any WoTC products you don't like?

I don't mean this as an insult or an attack, but your name has sprung up a few times in the posts I've happened to read over the past couple weeks, and it occurred to me that I can't recall ever reading a post of yours that hasn't been glowingly positive toward WoTC products.

Good point, though it might just be a case of "avatar association". He's "glowing and smiling" in his avatar so, irregardless of what he *says* in his posts, the smiling avatar is never forgotten and always associated with his words. BTW, I've recently realized that my Psych degree has no practical value! LoL

 

[Knight Otu]

MerricB, I'm curious...are there any WoTC products you don't like?

He mentioned in his other threads that he hasn't much use for the monster line books, and that he usually doesn't buy Forgotten Realms books.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

He mentioned in his other threads that he hasn't much use for the monster line books, and that he usually doesn't buy Forgotten Realms books.

Well, there's a difference between not needing a certain book (because you don't run a FR campaign, for instance,) and thinking it's bad. It's the second that I can't recall ever seeing.

 

[Li Shenron]

As I already said in the older thread, to me the Complete Adventurer sounds as a complete gamble.

It could really be a great book about "everything else you can do without a weapon or a spell" (I mentioned e.g. exploration, survival, stealth, knowledge, character interaction, mundane equipping, travel...) and as such for every character, albeit at different degrees.

What I am afraid of is that it could just have bad-taste crunchy bits for Rogues and Bards. Song & Silence already was an example of how limited were the designers' ideas about R&B's prestige classes and feats. The feats were either made core (skills feats - they were more appropriate as generic core feats rather than something you want to find in a cool advenced book), or included in CW already (the few combat feats). Definitely Bardic Music could have been completely covered by CArcane.

So that leaves CAdv the opportunity of having almost only new stuff... great, but before I see it I am afraid it could be worse than S&S itself.

 

[Li Shenron]

He mentioned in his other threads that he hasn't much use for the monster line books, and that he usually doesn't buy Forgotten Realms books.

I seem to remember that he actually likes all the monster books And the adventures, he cannot miss one! He is a great fan of Eberron. Other books are usually in the range between "interesting to check out" and "must have". And I sure he's the only one I heard of who actually bought and enjoyed Map Folio

In other words... possibly one of the most optimistic and enthusiastic D&Der on the web

 

[Knight Otu]

It's the second that I can't recall ever seeing.

I suspect he doesn't have much of an opinion on a book he doesn't have. But I have heard that he dislikes the Mass Combat System from the Miniatures Handbook.

And so this post isn't entirely off-topic, a few bits we know (or think to know) already:

[font=&quot]Posts by Rich Baker about Complete Adventurer (thread: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?threadid=282525 )

Adventurer has the spell thief (and a couple of others I don't know if I can tell you about yet).

[/font][font=&quot]
Information gleaned from the RPGA cards, originally posted in this thread: http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=93212

Complete Adventurer
Classes: Scout, Spellthief
Prestige Classes: Spell Dagger Evoker, Bloodhound, Daggerspell Adept, Dungeon Delver, Fochulcan Lyrist, Highland Stalker
Equipment: Barbed Dagger, Quickblade Rapier, Broadblade Shortsword, Fareye Oil, Flash Pellet, Healer's Balm, Keenear Powder

[/font]

 

[MerricB]

MerricB, I'm curious...are there any WoTC products you don't like?

I don't mean this as an insult or an attack, but your name has sprung up a few times in the posts I've happened to read over the past couple weeks, and it occurred to me that I can't recall ever reading a post of yours that hasn't been glowingly positive toward WoTC products.

Hehe. You need someone to counterbalance all the naysayers around here.

Honestly, there haven't been many Wizards products that I've bought that I'm really unhappy with. The Hero Builder's Guide, Defenders of the Faith and Masters of the Wild are three that I don't really like that much - and MotW is just because I find the book deadly dull.

Oh, I'm not that happy with the Book of Vile Darkness either. I feel that was a missed opportunity.

(If you ever want to see me talk about a d20 book I don't like, both the Quint. Druid and Cry Havoc are up there).

Errors in a book rarely bother me unless (a) they're glaring and (b) they affect my usage of the book. So, the complaints about books like Complete Divine pass me by on that score, as I really don't notice.

I guess to a large extent, I'm the sort of person that Wizards produce their books for. I run a fairly standard Greyhawk game, my players enjoy playing with the options (Feats, Prestige Classes, etc.) found in the Hero books, and I use varying books as sources to distinguish the play of the game. So, one session I might use a couple of monsters from the Fiend Folio, and the next session a few feats from the Miniatures Handbook.

I don't expect 100% usefulness from any book. If there's a certain amount of the book that is useful (or I expect I will find useful), then I'm happy. Complete Divine comes under that heading. I love the new (revised) domains and deity descriptions - though I'm not currently using them - and my players have fallen in love with the Practiced Spellcaster feat. It might be the only feat they ever use from the book... but it makes the book worthwhile, because it greatly increases their (and mine) enjoyment of the game.

A few quotes:

I seem to remember that he actually likes all the monster books.

I don't have the Draconomicon, though I may eventually get it. I do love the Monster Manual type books, however! In general, I prefer using a monster as originally written rather than expanding upon it.

And the adventures, he cannot miss one!

Except for a couple of Forgotten Realms modules. (Though I really should get City of the Spider Queen). I do love adventures, though, and I wish more d20 System modules were available in Ballarat.

He is a great fan of Eberron.

Love some of the concepts, but I love Greyhawk more... I'll probably buy the initial books (eventually), since I'm curious as to how it will turn out.

Other books are usually in the range between "interesting to check out" and "must have".

Mostly. Curious, I am. And there are many books I really would love to have!

And I sure he's the only one I heard of who actually bought and enjoyed Map Folio

Got me there. Map Folio I has its problems, but I have used it (and the players enjoyed having the props), and probably will again.

Well, there's a difference between not needing a certain book and thinking it's bad. It's the second that I can't recall ever seeing.

Cry Havoc. Urgh. I hoped it would fill the hole (mass combat) that the MHb had failed to fill. Guess not.

I suspect he doesn't have much of an opinion on a book he doesn't have. But I have heard that he dislikes the Mass Combat System from the Miniatures Handbook.

I think the "Mass" Combat System in the MHb is pretty good, but unfortunately it's not Mass Combat. More like "squad combat". I grew up with the 1st edition Battlesystem system and the Dragonlance mass battles. That's what I wanted to see. What is Douglas Niles doing these days?

The Random Dungeon section of the MHb is also disappointing - though I think I know why. (It has to do with the Goal of the game - a few modifications and it could be pretty good).

In other words... possibly one of the most optimistic and enthusiastic D&Der on the web

I hope so!

Cheers!

 

[diaglo]

In other words... possibly one of the most optimistic and enthusiastic D&Der on the web

bah... he doesn't hold a candle to a true D&D fanman. someone willing to play and buy stuff that has the D&D logo on it even tho it ain't really D&D.

 

[Li Shenron]

bah... he doesn't hold a candle to a true D&D fanman. someone willing to play and buy stuff that has the D&D logo on it even tho it ain't really D&D.

Well at least reading someone who seems to enjoy even the low points of this edition makes me feel like I am playing a great game and I want to play it more, while your posts -for example- don't often sound as a real appreciation to OD&D.

It's not better or worse to like one edition compared to another of course, it's that Merric highlights how much he likes about his favored edition, while you usually highlights that you dislike the others...

...I really hope you are not going to be upset by this comment, ok? If you are, I apologise in advance for being rude and inappropriate. Maybe you were being ironic and I didn't get it

 

[Joshua Randall]

I swear, diaglo must have a macro that scans each thread for keywords and then wraps them into an insulting post about the current edition. Fortunately there is the ignore feature....

But back on topic, I'm looking forward to Complete Adventurer. I always find my players really focused on two things: combat and spells. And ignoring two other things: skills and class features. I hope that Complete Adventurer will boost people's appreciation of the latter two, so that PCs become, well, more complete adventurers!