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4E Complete Psionic: Ardent (Aproved)

Patlin

Villager
This thread is for discussing whether this base class from Complete Psionic should be accepted into LEB. Complete Psionic was originally released 4/11/06.
 
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stonegod

Spawn of Khyber/LEB Judge
I have CompPsi, but no experience with Ardent's in play. Guess the easiest comparison is with Clerics.

- Same BAB
- Gain powers about the same time as Paladins
- PP design equiv to Psion, though fewer powers
- Get some abilities based upon mantles chosen

The close does not seem broken to me, but any others who have seen/played them?
 

drothgery

Community Supporter
It's probably a little on the underpowered side, I'd say (though other than putting a gestalt ardent//monk/atavist together for a PBP game that hasn't gotten off the ground yet, I've never played one); you're almost chosing your powers when you choose your mantles (most don't have a power at every level, and rarely have more than two powers at any level).
 

Erekose13

Villager
I put together a high level ardent and I'd agree that they are a bit underpowered. They get very difficult to plan out power progression because you are so limited.
 

stonegod

Spawn of Khyber/LEB Judge
Well, as a proposal, we can either (1) accept as is, (2) reject, or (3) have someone propose a "fix" (as we did with the swashbuckler). The class may be underpowered, but the question becomes is it super weak, or just not an optimal choice?
 

stonegod

Spawn of Khyber/LEB Judge
Erekose13 said:
I'm always of the opinion that if it isn't overpowered dont fix it.
That is generally my inclination so long as it isn't soooo bad that it just does not make an even flavorful choice.
 

Patlin

Villager
Seems balanced to me, though I haven't tested it. One of the characters in my current game has indicated interest in using it in his (massively multiclassed) path to pyrokineticist.
 

Rystil Arden

Villager
I think it is certainly strong enough to be flavourful. Swashbuckler is one of the few classes that is just universally terrible.
 

Patlin

Villager
My wife is playing an ardent now, since her Favored Soul took a greataxe critical at full power attack to the head recently -- the npc barbarian rolled two natural twenties in a row when he decided he was going to die and wanted to try and take someone with him!

I'm not sure if I like the ardent or hate the ardent, but I am sure it's an absolute pain to plan out properly. And the life mantle completely sucks for low level play, so don't make the mistake of thinking of a low level ardent as a healer!
 

Rystil Arden

Villager
Looks more-or-less fine to me. Compared to the Wilder, it has a similar number of powers but more restricted (though from a slightly wider list if you somehow get around the restrictions), though it gets new levels of powers more quickly, but it lacks Wild Surge. Seems good, so YES
 

marcielle

Villager
Actually, it is the most versatile of psionic classes since you can basically MAKE UP your own mantles(The Mind's Eye: Expanded Classes, Part Four). Here's the lowdown:
1.you can add powers to any mantle so long as the total number of powers in the mantle do not exceed 10
2.only restriction to the powers added is it must be thematically appropriate. This is basically a DM's call thing. Some might allow you to add expansion into conflict-based mantle, some might allow those psionically crafted weapons, etc.
3.you can make up your own entirely from scratch by substitution so long as it does not directly offend your DM's logic ( no teleportation in natural world)
4.for coolness, you can exchange energy mantle for a specific elemental one(you can never take energy if you take a specific elemental mantle).

Also, there was some wyrd wording used when they described which powers they can learn. Apparently, they can learn any power that they can manifest. Now this only makes a smidgeon of sense IF the normal 'you can't spend more PP than you manifester level' doesn't apply to Ardents. Otherwise you'd be stuck with a ton of powers you couldn't cast till you get to a higher level. However, the book then goes on to say that the normal rules DO apply. As far as I know, there has been no errata so it is DM's call again on this one. Basically so long as you don't try to completely BS your DM Ardent can let you do anything another manifester can do almost as well AND do other things they could never do.
 

twilsemail

Villager
[MENTION=6672328]marcielle[/MENTION]; you do realize this is a five year old thread from a previous incarnation of this forum, right?
 

stonegod

Spawn of Khyber/LEB Judge
Wow. Thread necromancy indeed.

Could be a mistake. Or one of those super stealthy spammers that don't actually spam I keep reading about.
 

renau1g

Villager
I was thinking it was found via Google. I know I had that before.

re: spammer... seems very on topic, not just, Wow gamers that is a great idea, I love WOW, the best character is a Night Elf Mohawk warrior (or something)
 

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