Converting Planescape monsters

[freyar]

Dex 10, +8 NA is fine for me.

Well, I think I meant to have the acid, cold, and fire resistance, but no immunities beyond those of living constructs. However, it's a good point that the originals lost the equivalent of those energy resistances. So let's in fact drop the modron's energy resistance.

The ADD modronoids have magic resistance, while the ADD modrons (below the septon) don't. So that argues for a small amount of SR.

I'm just missing it -- where is the metal-affecting vulnerability?

I'm happy to use shortsword stats for the blades.

 

[Cleon]

Dex 10, +8 NA is fine for me.

Well, I think I meant to have the acid, cold, and fire resistance, but no immunities beyond those of living constructs. However, it's a good point that the originals lost the equivalent of those energy resistances. So let's in fact drop the modron's energy resistance.

The ADD modronoids have magic resistance, while the ADD modrons (below the septon) don't. So that argues for a small amount of SR.

Agreed.

I'm just missing it -- where is the metal-affecting vulnerability?

Literally in the stat blocks as a Special Weakness:

MODRONOID XALDRA: AC 2 (metal plates); MV 9; HD 6; hp 31; THAC0 15; #AT 2; Dmg 1d6+2 (arm blades); SW metal-affecting spells; MR 10%; SZ M (5′ tall); ML fearless (20); Int average (10); AL CN; XP 420.

Updating the Modronoid Working Draft.

 

[Cleon]

Do we need an "Arms Blades" Special Attack entry or shall I just put the critical threat range in the Attack line.

I guess it wouldn't hurt.

Would this do?

Arm Blades: Each of the modronoid's arms is fitted with a retractile short-sword sized blade. An arm blade does 1d6 piercing damage and threatens a critical hit on a natural attack roll of 19–20.​

 

[freyar]

OK, the Magic Resistance of the original is 10%, which roughly translates to CR+3 (looking at some of Shade's old notes). We're probably looking at, what, CR 4 since they don't have much in the way of SAs? So SR 7 or thereabouts. Sound ok to you?

Your Arm Blade SA is fine. I guess it's (Ex).

I'm not sure what to do with the metal-affecting vulnerability (I must just not have seen it!). Should we just say they take extra (double?) damage from chill metal and heat metal? I'm not really sure what I'd do with repel metal or transmute metal to wood.

 

[Cleon]

OK, the Magic Resistance of the original is 10%, which roughly translates to CR+3 (looking at some of Shade's old notes). We're probably looking at, what, CR 4 since they don't have much in the way of SAs? So SR 7 or thereabouts. Sound ok to you?

Hmm… I'd eyeball it as around Challenge Rating 3 or 4 but comparing it to, say an Ogre, I'll agree to CR 4.

Spell Resistance 7 feels too weak. I'm inclined to make it SR 10 so a 4th-level caster has a 25% failure chance.

As well as being a nice round number, these creatures can be encountered in groups.

For example, Chapter V: Modron Madness of The Great Modron March (1997) features a group of seven modronoids who the PCs will have to fight, most likely while facing Valran Stonefist, the 7th-level magic-user who made them (a CR 7 wizard in 3E terms).

Seven CR 4 monsters is an EL 10 battle. On paper that's a tough encounter for a 7th-level party. If we want a 7th level party's spellcasters to have a 10% spell failure chance the modronoids need Spell Resistance 10; if they had SR 7 a 7th level caster would blow through their spell resistance like it wasn't there.

Incidentally, the party's final encounter with Valran is in Chapter X: The Flower Infernal when he's become a 13th level spellcaster and a decaton modronoid, so must be at least CR 14. I'm presuming we'll use him as a model for our Hierarch Modronoid sample creature.

 

[Cleon]

Your Arm Blade SA is fine. I guess it's (Ex).

Works for me.

I'm not sure what to do with the metal-affecting vulnerability (I must just not have seen it!). Should we just say they take extra (double?) damage from chill metal and heat metal? I'm not really sure what I'd do with repel metal or transmute metal to wood.

I was thinking either double damage (probably only on a failed save?), or 50% extra damage as per Vulnerability to Energy (i.e. "takes half again as much (+50%) damage as normal from the effect, regardless of whether a saving throw is allowed, or if the save is a success or failure.")

As for the other spells, the effects are spelled out in their descriptions:

Repel Metal​

Repelled at the rate of 40 feet per round unless fixed to something solid or they weigh more than 500 pounds, in which case they are unaffected. I'd probably tweak this so they move as if facing a powerful wind.​

​

Rusting Grasp​

Treat as ferrous creature:​

 "rusting grasp instantaneously deals 3d6 points of damage +1 per caster level (maximum +15) per successful attack."​

​

If we wanted to make it complicated, we could allow the attack to target the modronoid's armor plating or arm blades as per the spell:​

 "instantaneously destroys 1d6 points of Armor Class gained from metal armor (to the maximum amount of protection the armor offered) through corrosion"​

 "A metal weapon that is hit is destroyed. Note: Striking at an opponent’s weapon provokes an attack of opportunity. Also, you must touch the weapon and not the other way around.)."​

​

Possibly allow the attacker to choose to target the modronoid's armor/weapon INSTEAD of doing damage, or have it as bonus effect for critical hit?

I'd maybe allow a saving throw to prevent the loss of NA or weapon. Spell Resistance doesn't work against rusting grasp.​

​

Transmute Metal to Wood​

Arm blades take a –2 penalty on attack and damage rolls and break on a natural attack roll of 1 or 2.​

Natural armor bonus is reduced by 2 and loses an additional point every time it is struck with a natural attack roll of 19 or 20.​

Presumably an arm with its blade destroyed or broken does lethal punching damage, so 1d3+4 bludgeoning like a gauntlet or 1d4+4 piercing like a spiked gauntlet, depending on how deadly the remains are.

 

[Cleon]

Okay, how about this:

Vulnerability to Metal-Affecting Powers (Ex): A modronoid takes half again as much (+50%) damage as normal from effects that target its metallic components, such as the chill metal and heat metal spells, regardless of whether a saving throw is allowed, or if the save is a success or failure.

A modronoid is affected normally by rust attacks, such as those of a rust monster or a rusting grasp spell.

The spell transmute metal to wood gives the modronoid a –2 penalty on the attack and damage rolls of its arm blades and –2 reduction to its natural armor bonus. If it rolls a natural attack roll of 1 or 2 with a transmuted arm blade the weapon splinters, reducing the damage to 1d3+4 piercing with no critical threat multiplier. Every time a transmuted modronoid is struck with a natural attack roll of 19 or 20 it loses an additional point of armor bonus.​

 

[freyar]

That will work for the metal-affecting powers, but did you want to put something in for repel metal?

SR 10 is ok.

Seems like that's about it for special abilities. Do you agree?

 

[Cleon]

That will work for the metal-affecting powers, but did you want to put something in for repel metal?

After reading the spell description I wasn't sure if it was necessary.

Following the RAW, wouldn't repel metal or stone just affect a modronoid as if it were a metal or metal-armored object of its weight? Thus if modronoids weigh more than 500 pounds the spell does nothing, but if they weigh less than it automatically (no save or resistance) pushes them away at the rate of 40 feet per round.

The spell repel metal or stone pushes a modronoid away from the caster at the rate of 40 feet per round.​

My original idea, however, was to treat repel metal as affecting modronoids like a hurricane force wind.

Which would be:

The spell repel metal or stone pushes a modronoid away from the caster as if it were a hurricane force wind that uses the caster's spell DC for its Fortitude saving throws. See the Weather rules for Powerful Storms for the wind effects of a hurricane.​

I like the "hurricane wind" version as it's a bit more "cinematic" than the standard autopushing effect of repel metal.

 

[freyar]

The other thing good about the hurricane version is that a standard-size Medium modronoid would take damage from being blown away. That makes them more vulnerable vs the usual just moved back 40 ft, which seems like the intent. So let's go with that version.