Converting True Dragons

[Cleon]

I dunno, might be neat to have a beastial true dragon. But I see where you're coming from.

Well I'd be OK with making them dragons with age categories. It's not like they have that many other abilities to complicate them.

Oh why not, this is the "True Dragon" thread, after all.

Now the original had a base of 12 HD and is 50' long. That's the same HD base as a 2E Black Dragon or Brass Dragon, both of which are 30' long.
The extra 20' can easily be handwaved away because these are "winged serpents rather than a giant winged lizard".

That HD base suggests their physical stats could resemble a Black Dragon, while their Int of 8-9 suggests their mental stats are somewhere between a Black Dragon and a White.

They have an AC three points higher than a Black or Brass dragon. Since they resemble giant snakes, how about giving them a Dex of 15 or 17 like a Monstrous Viper?

That would make something like:

Age------Hit-Dice-----Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha-Armour
01--T---4d12+4(30)-----10--17--13---7--12---6 +3NA
02--S---7d12+5(52)-----12--17--13---7--12---6 +6NA
03--M--10d12+20(85)----14--17--15---9--12---6 +9NA
04--M--13d12+26(110)---16--17--15---9--12---8 +12NA
05--L--16d12+48(152)---18--17--17--11--12--10 +15NA
06--L--19d12+76(199)---22--17--19--11--12--12 +18NA
07--H-22d12+110(253)---26--15--21--13--14--12 +21NA
08--H-25d12+125(287)---28--15--21--13--14--12 +24NA
09--H-28d12+168(350)---30--15--23--15--16--14 +27NA
10--H-31d12+186(387)---32--15--23--15--16--14 +30NA
11--G-34d12+238(459)---34--15--25--17--16--16 +33NA
12--G-37d12+296(536)---36--15--27--19--18--18 +36NA

What thinks thee?

Note: You may notice I've lowered the Strength a point and upped the Wisdom a point, as a homage to the Viper having a base Str 10, Wis 12.

 

[freyar]

That's probably pretty reasonable. I can go with all that.

 

[Shade]

Added to Homebrews.

We can borrow constrict from the sea serpents and our rain dragon (tlalocoatl)...

Constrict (Ex): A tlalocoatl of Medium size or larger deals damage with a successful grapple check. The amount of damage dealt depends upon the creature's size, as indicated on the following chart. The tlalocoatl adds 1-1/2 times its Strength bonus on damage rolls made to constrict.

Size Constrict Damage
Medium 1d8
Large 2d8
Huge 3d8
Gargantuan 4d8
Colossal 6d8

 

[Cleon]

Added to Homebrews.

We can borrow constrict from the sea serpents and our rain dragon (tlalocoatl)...

Constrict (Ex): A tlalocoatl of Medium size or larger deals damage with a successful grapple check. The amount of damage dealt depends upon the creature's size, as indicated on the following chart. The tlalocoatl adds 1-1/2 times its Strength bonus on damage rolls made to constrict.

Size Constrict Damage
Medium 1d8
Large 2d8
Huge 3d8
Gargantuan 4d8
Colossal 6d8

Well we need to add a Tiny and a Small:

Size Constrict Damage
Tiny 1d4
Small 1d6
Medium 1d8
Large 2d8
Huge 3d8
Gargantuan 4d8
Colossal 6d8

There's a disconnect below Large from the standard progression is d6/d8/d10/2d8/3d8/4d8/6d8, but I have no difficulties with it - the Medium and smaller ones are juveniles, so might have underdeveloped tails.

 

[Shade]

Not necessarily. The sea serpents simply do not grant the constrict ability until Medium size, despite the fact that some are smaller. That said, I don't mind givng the bestiary dragon constrict at all sizes, considering its relative lack of abilities.

Shall we give them swallow whole as well? Sea serpents have it, and it is definitely a snake-like trait.

 

[Cleon]

Not necessarily. The sea serpents simply do not grant the constrict ability until Medium size, despite the fact that some are smaller. That said, I don't mind givng the bestiary dragon constrict at all sizes, considering its relative lack of abilities.

Shall we give them swallow whole as well? Sea serpents have it, and it is definitely a snake-like trait.

I'll vote against giving them swallow whole.

The original doesn't have it, and they won't have difficulty eating their victims if they cook them 'til their nice and tender using their heat-aura.

 

[Shade]

OK, fair enough.

When it flies, the air around it in a 10' radius becomes superheated; all within the radius take the damage noted in the dragon's statistics table. Note that once the dragon lands, the air around it becomes normal in temperature. Dragons are not harmed by any heat, magical or natural.

Do we want to make it always active, or limit it to once every 1d4 rounds like a breath weapon?

Limit it to flight only, or anytime?

I propose the radius should increase with age category or size, as well.

It sounds like we need to add "immunity to fire" to the special abilities.

 

[Cleon]

Do we want to make it always active, or limit it to once every 1d4 rounds like a breath weapon?

Limit it to flight only, or anytime?

I propose the radius should increase with age category or size, as well.

It sounds like we need to add "immunity to fire" to the special abilities.

I read it as being always active when it flies (indeed, it may use the blast of superhot air to fly, like a jet engine). Thus it damages every round, but presumably does less per round than most dragon's breath weapons.

Thus, I'd limit it to flight only...

...then I'd give it Hover as a bonus feat.

The radius should definitely increase for bigger/older dragons. Might as well scale to size, like a True Dragon's breath weapon.

Tiny - 5 ft. radius?
Small 10 ft. radius?
Medium 15 ft. radius?
Large 20 ft. radius?
Huge 30 ft. radius?
Gargantuan 40 ft. radius?
Colossal 50 ft. radius?

 

[Shade]

That progression looks good, and yeah, let's give 'em Hover as a bonus feat.

Should the flight be supernatural, like a beholder's, and thus grant the permanent feather fall effect?

 

[freyar]

This is looking great!

I vote for Ex flight since it has wings.

The damage in the table is quite high compared even to many breath weapons. Decrease it somewhat?