Converting World of Greyhawk monsters

Not open for further replies.


Extradimensional Explorer
-2 Dex, +2 Con? Bumping the claws is good, then, just one step on each line.

What did you think about movement types? Maybe we should just leave it as for the Subsumed Minds. (And, frankly, with the loss of Su SAs and SQs, maybe that implies loss of Su movement -- I didn't even think about that before.)

Any natural armor? I could see some.

We should put in that skin puppets become mold wyrms on death, but maybe that's flavor.

log in or register to remove this ad


Monster Junkie
Yeah, I think you're right about the implied loss of Su movement.

I'd say no to natural armor. It sounds like these things are barely held together and just waiting to rupture. Plus, they had AC 10 originally.


Extradimensional Explorer
Ok, let's leave the movement line as it was for Subsumed Minds and let any loss of Su movement be implied. That gives a DM some wiggle room if Su flight is really desired.

No natural is fine for me.

Do you agree on putting the "death transformation" into the flavor text?


Extradimensional Explorer
I think we can take out this line "If such a creature is affected by the partial imprint ability of a false Keraptis, the hierarchical mind will likely move to the more powerful body, leaving the original false Keraptis body as a Subsumed Mind" and put in that "Mossmutter's spores cannot convert such a powerful creature into a Skin Puppet, and they kill their victim instead."

Also, we should put in a line in the "death flavor paragraph" that "Upon Mossmutter's destruction, all Skin Puppets immediately die as well, becoming ordinary mold wyrms."

Edit: Oh, we need to bump the claw damage!
Last edited:


Extradimensional Explorer
:D More like grant cuts to my secret plan to dominate the world with skin puppets! But I'll be back at it soon.


Extradimensional Explorer
sample skin puppet

I'm just basing this on the subsumed mind sample. Also, I noticed that I forgot the "Small Humanoid (gnome)" line before the HD in the subsumed mind sample. Oops!

Also, we should change the alignment of the skin puppets to CE to match Mossmutter.

Shade, can you check over this? Especially the attacks; I couldn't remember or find in the SRD the interaction between manufactured and natural weapons in the full attack line (so I followed the skeleton).

Finally, should we add a line to the subsumed mind and skin puppet templates that they can be reversed with wish or miracle?

Skin Puppet Gnome Warrior 1
Small Plant
Hit Dice: 1d8+3 (7 hp)
Initiative: -1
Speed: 20 ft. (4 squares)
Armor Class: 15 (+1 size, -1 Dex, +4 chain shirt, +1 light shield), touch 10, flat-footed 15
Base Attack/Grapple: +0/–4
Attack: Longsword +0 melee (1d6/19–20) or claw +0 melee (1d4 plus claw spores) or light crossbow -1 ranged (1d6/19–20)
Full Attack: Longsword +0 melee (1d6/19–20) or 2 claws +0 melee (1d4 plus claw spores) or light crossbow -1 ranged (1d6/19–20)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Instrument of hierarchical mind
Special Qualities: Gnome traits (except Sp abilities), hierarchical mind awareness, single actions only
Saves: Fort +5, Ref -1, Will –1
Abilities: Str 11, Dex 9, Con 16, Int —, Wis 9, Cha 8
Skills: —
Feats: Weapon Focus (light crossbow)
Environment: Any.
Organization: Solitary, ganglion (2-6), or hierarchical mind (3-40 skin puppets plus possibly Mossmutter).
Challenge Rating: 1/3
Treasure: None.
Alignment: Chaotic evil.
Advancement: —
Level Adjustment: —


Monster Junkie
Good points. Updated skin puppet and subsumed mind.

Some creatures combine attacks with natural and manufactured weapons when they make a full attack. When they do so, the manufactured weapon attack is considered the primary attack unless the creature’s description indicates otherwise and any natural weapons the creature also uses are considered secondary natural attacks. These secondary attacks do not interfere with the primary attack as attacking with an off-hand weapon does, but they take the usual –5 penalty (or –2 with the Multiattack feat) for such attacks, even if the natural weapon used is normally the creature’s primary natural weapon.


Extradimensional Explorer
In that case, let's change the skin puppet full attack to

Full Attack: Longsword +0 melee (1d6/19–20) and claw -5 melee (1d4 plus claw spores) or 2 claws +0 melee (1d4 plus claw spores) or light crossbow -1 ranged (1d6/19–20)

I figure they can only use 1 claw if they also have a sword. ;)

Then these might just be done! :D :D :D


Extradimensional Explorer
I believe that this might actually be it! (I won't breathe sigh of relief until Echohawk can check in, though! ;))

I think this was Keraptis's plan all along --- not to trap adventurers but monster designers. :lol: That was worse than a maze spell.

Not open for further replies.

Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition Starter Box

An Advertisement