convincing an npc to kill themselves.

[Drake M]

This ones way darker than my usual. First real evil character. It so happens he has a vendetta against the main villain the party is after, so they've joined forces.

I'm running a 12th level human bard/nightmare spinner/dread witch/dirgesinger.
He's max ranked in intimidate, bluff, diplomacy, etc. Has things like glibness. Nymphs kiss. 22 cha.

Fear and mind things are his thing.

For flavor reasons, I want to make him convince an npc to kill themselves. What can I use to do this?

Bluff check that the devil is inside him and needs to be cut out?
Get him to fanatical through diplomacy and have him sacrifice himself?
suggestion? Dominate person?

 

[Lindeloef]

Talk to your DM for input / aid. It is much easier to do if your DM thinks it is a cool thing to do.

 

[Grogg of the North]

I'm running a 12th level human bard/nightmare spinner/dread witch/dirgesinger.
He's max ranked in intimidate, bluff, diplomacy, etc. Has things like glibness. Nymphs kiss. 22 cha.

Wait ... what?! How are you pulling off dirgesinger AND nymph's kiss. Dirgesinger is any non-good and Nymph's Kiss requires you to be exalted!

 

[Drake M]

Nymphs kiss is sort of a long story with a dm's ok. He was once a bard who lived with the fey until they were slaughtered. He seeks revenge. Thats the extremely abridged version.

Dm is on board with pretty much any evils I dream up.
the npc would likely be a crewman on the pirate ship we happen to be on.

 

[Whisper72]

Well... as a DM I would rule out straight out suicide. Most description I know of domineering and related spells / powers state that self-preservation at the deepest level prevents this. So. time to get creative.

Get the NPC up on top of a tower (top of the main mast of the ship) and let him get so scared of some perceived threat that he jumps off trying to save himself (falling to his death) or similar setup.
Convince the NPC he is really cold and dying from being frozen, the only solution is to jump into a fire to counter the cold.
Convince the NPC he has the power to fly... of a deep end...
Convince the NPC that some type of infestation / worm has entered his body and needs to be cut-out or he will die an agonizing death. He shouldn't worry, you will heal him up afterward... sure thing, scouts honor...
'suicide by cop': convince the NPC he/she is all-powerful and let him/her pick a fight with an opponent that will result in a sure death
Send nightmares and other grim images of such gruesomeness that the heart stops: save versus petrification or die from fright...
Convince the NPC s/he is thirsty. REALLY thirsty. Provide (salt?) water and let him/her drink him/herself to death

In short: plenty stuff to do...

 

[Drake M]

The more gruesome this act will be to watch for everyone else involved, the better. The purpose of this act is to showcase to the party why this guy has to go.

He's supposed to start off as a "necessary evil", and eventually be written out of the story by the rest of the party realizing just how terrible and villainous he is then turning against him. DM and I agree that's a fitting progression and end to a character who is, in essence, an evil master manipulator.

I like some of those suggestions

 

[Whisper72]

If you want the character to be dispelled by the PC's, I think it is not just the gruesomeness of the act itself that is important, but especially the mindset / attitude of the evil person. To really enjoy and gloat about it. Keep repeating how much fun it was. Maybe even (thinking it to be 'funny') mentioning off-hand how s/he can do the same thing to the other players... and how enjoyable that might be... in short, not just do loathsome things, but be a loathsome personality...

Especially the threat to the PC's themselves ought to convince them that they have made a deal with someone who might turn on them at any corner... that should motivate to expell or even kill him/her...

 

[Man in the Funny Hat]

See Star Trek. Kirk did it twice. Nomad and M5.

 

[pemerton]

My one clear memory of this happening in a campaign was quite a different context from what the OP describes.

The PCs were attempting to make contact with an exiled god. The gate to the prison plane in which the god was trapped was a powerful angel (a solar, in D&D terms - the scenario was Bastion of Broken Souls, adapted to Rolemaster). As per her instructions from the Emperor of Heaven, she was refusing to let the PCs pass through, and prepared to fight them to stop this. But one of the PCs made the case about the stakes of the situation - making contact with the exiled god was necessary to learn how to stop the souls of newborn humans being stolen away by dark powers - and persuaded the angel that she was being used as a pawn in an unjust compromise that had been reached between the Emperor of Heaven and the Lords of Karma. The angel then allowed herself to be killed by the PC in question.

Mechanically, this took the form of a skill check (I can't remember now which one, but the Rolemaster analogue to Diplomacy in D&D). The DC was very high, but Rolemaster has a mechanic whereby a roll that fall short by only a modest amount permits a re-roll at a bonus - and with these bonuses the player was able to make a successful roll.

In an earlier Rolemaster campaign we had a PC magic-user whose schtick included inflicting victims with depression by toying with their souls, but I can't remember now whether this ever got to the stage of victim's killing themselves. Mechanically, this was a series of spell effects that inflicted Depression crits (an optional crit table, from Rolemaster Companion III as best I recall).

In pure mechanical terms, persuading an NPC to kill him-/herself does not need to be any more difficult, or resource/playtime intensive, than killing him/her directly. I think the issue is more about maintaining the verisimilitude of the gameworld.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

This ones way darker than my usual. First real evil character. It so happens he has a vendetta against the main villain the party is after, so they've joined forces.

I'm running a 12th level human bard/nightmare spinner/dread witch/dirgesinger.
He's max ranked in intimidate, bluff, diplomacy, etc. Has things like glibness. Nymphs kiss. 22 cha.

Fear and mind things are his thing.

For flavor reasons, I want to make him convince an npc to kill themselves. What can I use to do this?

Bluff check that the devil is inside him and needs to be cut out?
Get him to fanatical through diplomacy and have him sacrifice himself?
suggestion? Dominate person?

You don't have Nymph's kiss. You have broken the requirements, the feat is gone.