Core Handbook Errors Discussion

[phil500]

Clerics need to spend 4 feats to wear full plate and heavy shields.

that HAS to be a mistake.

 

[heirodule]

So a 1000 cubic foot cube? Isn't that easier to say?

what they should say is 10³ ft.

 

[WhatGravitas]

Clerics need to spend 4 feats to wear full plate and heavy shields.

that HAS to be a mistake.

Or the cleric is more of a support cleric and the divine-frontline-basher role is now filled by the paladin.

Cheers, LT.

 

[malraux]

what they should say is 10³ ft.

Nope. 10³ ft³ would be correct.

 

[Lacyon]

Nope. 10³ ft³ would be correct.

Or (10 ft)³. Spelled out, ten-foot cube.

 

[Mort_Q]

Clerics need to spend 4 feats to wear full plate and heavy shields.

that HAS to be a mistake.

Design decisions you don't like are not always mistakes.

 

[Ashardalon]

Maybe it's supposed to say "if the target attacks, the target remains invisible." That would compare to 3.5 and earlier versions. The non-Greater Invisibility probably says that if the target attacks, then the spell effect ends.

At least according to the photo that Plane Sailing refers to, the power says "if the target attacks, the target becomes visible." Though I seem to recall that there was another error on that page that hadn't been fixed at DDXP, but was changed since (namely an attack using wisdom rather than intelligence).

 

[Tarril Wolfeye]

Minion Mess

Many Minions in the MM are wrong:
Cyclops Guard: Level 14, half level modifier on ability scores is +5
Abyssal Ghoul Myrmidon: level 23, abilities modifier +10
Hobgoblin Grunt: level 3, abilities +0
Hobgoblin Warrior: level 8, abilities +3
Grimlock Minion: level 14, abilities +5
Grimlock Follower: level 22, abilities +8
Human Rabble: level 2, abilities +0
Kruthik Hatchling: level 2, abilities +0
Orc Drudge: level 4, abilities +0
Orc Warrior: level 9, abilities +3
Troglodyte Warrior: level 12, abilities +5
Vampire Spawn Fleshripper: level 5, abilities +3
Yuan-ti Snaketongue Zealot: level 12, abilities +5
Zombie Rotter: level 3, abilities +0

Some of these (Human Rabble, Zombie Rotter, Kruthik Hatchling, Hobgoblin Grunt, Vampire Spawn) are also in KotS, Orcs are the same as excerpt - all including the errors.
I just hope their defenses are the right numbers.

Math Errors are worse now, because the math should work.

 

[silentounce]

Or (10 ft)³. Spelled out, ten-foot cube.

Actually, spelled out, that would be "ten feet, cubed."

But I don't see how "10 foot cube" is confusing anyway. What else could they mean besides a cube with ten feet per side? Especially, considering the context. When would a measure of cubic feet be necessary in this version of D&D? If they had meant 10 cubic feet they would have said so.


And, as far as the minion errors, which version of the MM do you have, the online version, or the pre-release version? Because if it's in the online version, well, I'm not concerned.

 

[Tarril Wolfeye]

And, as far as the minion errors, which version of the MM do you have, the online version, or the pre-release version? Because if it's in the online version, well, I'm not concerned.

It's in Keep on the Shadowfell too (the real one).
Concerned now?

 

[GorTeX]

Or (10 ft)³. Spelled out, ten-foot cube.

still doesn't get it right, as that could be spread out in a different shaped area. Saying a 10 foot cube spells out that it is a cube with 10 feet per side--it's not specifically talking about the volume of that cube, but the shape of that cube.

 

[GorTeX]

Many Minions in the MM are wrong:
Cyclops Guard: Level 14, half level modifier on ability scores is +5
Abyssal Ghoul Myrmidon: level 23, abilities modifier +10
Hobgoblin Grunt: level 3, abilities +0
Hobgoblin Warrior: level 8, abilities +3
Grimlock Minion: level 14, abilities +5
Grimlock Follower: level 22, abilities +8
Human Rabble: level 2, abilities +0
Kruthik Hatchling: level 2, abilities +0
Orc Drudge: level 4, abilities +0
Orc Warrior: level 9, abilities +3
Troglodyte Warrior: level 12, abilities +5
Vampire Spawn Fleshripper: level 5, abilities +3
Yuan-ti Snaketongue Zealot: level 12, abilities +5
Zombie Rotter: level 3, abilities +0

Some of these (Human Rabble, Zombie Rotter, Kruthik Hatchling, Hobgoblin Grunt, Vampire Spawn) are also in KotS, Orcs are the same as excerpt - all including the errors.
I just hope their defenses are the right numbers.

Math Errors are worse now, because the math should work.

I don't have the books, but it looks like there is some reduction going on in the minons..from KotS, I had assumed it was either level/3 or (level-3)/2.

 

[malraux]

still doesn't get it right, as that could be spread out in a different shaped area. Saying a 10 foot cube spells out that it is a cube with 10 feet per side--it's not specifically talking about the volume of that cube, but the shape of that cube.

Oh, so they mean that the shape is supposed to be ridged? So I couldn't mend a 20 foot pole with the mend spell?

 

[Tarril Wolfeye]

I don't have the books, but it looks like there is some reduction going on in the minons..from KotS, I had assumed it was either level/3 or (level-3)/2.

In MM other minions have their level/2 bonus just right. Just look at the excerpt for Legion Devil.

 

[jaer]

Oh, so they mean that the shape is supposed to be ridged? So I couldn't mend a 20 foot pole with the mend spell?

You could mend most of it, if you set it at an angle against a wall...

 

[Grazzt]

....
I just hope their defenses are the right numbers.

Math Errors are worse now, because the math should work.

Formulas in the DMG for monster's are not really hard set like in 3.x. They are guidelines more or less.

Since a monster doesn't really follow the same rules for defenses a PC does (no 10 + 1/2 level + ability mod), those scores can apparently be adjusted as the DM/designer sees fit (most tend to be 1-3 points higher or lower if they are adjusted away from the suggested 'base'). Only numbers that really seem to be hard set with monster design are hit points, XP, and skills. Defenses, attack bonuses, damage, AC all seem to be pretty flexible based on what you want/need.

 

[Xfer83]

So how is it that once again the cleric gets a better top end BOOM spell than the wizard eh? What about those role thingys!

Cheers

I'd like to second this. I can't see any way that the cleric power isn't better than the wizard power. The cleric power seems to be a perfect controller power, and the wizard one seems inferior in every way. Any ideas from the books that might help with this?

 

[Spatula]

When we originally saw the photograph of some of the wizard powers, one of them was 'Greater Invisibility'.

Wizard utility 16

Daily, arcane, illusion
Standard action, ranged 20
Target you or one creature
Effect: The target is invisible until the end of your next turn, if the target attacks, the target becomes invisible.
Sustain Minor: If the target is within range, you can sustain the effect


One assumes that there is a lower level power just called 'Invisibility' since this is a 'Greater' version. However, it doesn't seem particularly great...

If there is a lower level version of invisibility, how does it compare with this one? Any possibility of a typo creeping in via copy and paste and not amending greater invis to allow attacks or something?

Greater Invis ends if the target attacks (to correct the above typo).

The lower-level version has range 5 and sustain standard, making it hard to use in combat (or to use on anyone but the wizard himself).

 

[Xorn]

Same issue with Fighter's Sure Strike as with Ranger's Careful Attack.

The attack roll is ABIL + 2 vs DEF, and 1[W] damage.

Basically they reduce your damage by ABIL for +2 to hit. The higher your ABIL gets, it seems like the worse this ability is.

I did have a thought on this, though. As long as you don't need a 1 to miss or a 20 to hit (which should be rare with the scaling), +2 to hit is a 10% greater chance to hit, period. At the same time, giving up +4 damage at low level is probably similar to giving up +8 damage at high level.

So you're probably giving up a proportionate amount of damage for a 10% hit increase, at any level. As a matter of fact, at high level, who wouldn't give up +8 damage for +8 to hit!? (+40% to hit)

I have a feeling the DEX + 2 for Careful Attack and STR + 2 for Sure Strike is NOT an error, now.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Greater Invis ends if the target attacks (to correct the above typo).

The lower-level version has range 5 and sustain standard, making it hard to use in combat (or to use on anyone but the wizard himself).

Sorry about the typo!

Interesting about the lower level version. The paragon version at level 16 doesn't seem much better, frankly. You can cast some extra utility spells while maintaining it, I suppose.