Core Rules PDF's errata'd yet?

[malraux]

I am very interested in the reasoning why the PDF books cannot include errata even if a book is not republished.

It seems that keeping them updated in case they need to be reprinted would mean you are a step ahead on the work.

Say Adventurer's Vault needs a reprint, and you fix some of the errors including typos now, then you will easily be able to have everything ready when it comes time to print.

Best guess is that the process of fixing errata is labor intensive. There's no reason to do stuff like that unless its going to be used.

 

[justanobody]

Best guess is that the process of fixing errata is labor intensive. There's no reason to do stuff like that unless its going to be used.

Updating the PDF copies to properly errat'd versions that will always exist for sale when the print run of the physical books run out to maintain a revenue stream seems like good grounds for "going to be used".

Not to mention updating a PDF isn't all that hard, if in fact those illegal copies Scott had to deal with prior to the real books being release were in fact PDF files sent to the publishers, then typesetting isn't a bother since you aren't printing and just adding characters with the proper installed fonts that are only in house for WotC as they created them.

I don't know what program is used to create these PDFs, but I would hope they are not locked versions so that WotC themselves cannot edit them and add text as needed to pages. What is the Acrobat command? CTRL+T or CTRL+<click> with the Text function selected?

Not real different than using say notepad to edit an ascii file, or wordpad to edit an RTF file.

So time isn't really something that should be costing a lot since you could copy and paste the text from the same location of the errata PDFs.

Heck just add the latest errata pages after the final page of the PDFs. Not as professional as doing it the right way, but at least it is included since you don't expect to print out your own PHB, Adventurer's Vault, etc from PDFs as that would cost more than the physical copy.

Working with and fixing a PDF is not as hard as some would have you believe, it is just the manner in which it is done and by whom. If, like Scott suggests, a new person is needed to be hired for that department, then I think that should be done quickly as WotC does a lot dealing with text that it might improve product quality and speed of delivery with less stress involved on all parties within and without the company.

 

[malraux]

If the change is something like +1 to +3, you are right. But if it is instead addition or subtraction of significant amounts of text, the books are going to need to be retypeset, as additional text is going to spill over.

edit: Looking at the first listed errata, it involves adding "and paragon tier feats." to a paragraph. That's going to add an additional line to the paragraph on the page. That space is going to have to be pulled from somewhere. Making that choice properly is what the typesetting process is about. Sure, the fact that its electronic does ease the job considerably, but its still more that just simply adding the text.

 

[justanobody]

If the change is something like +1 to +3, you are right. But if it is instead addition or subtraction of significant amounts of text, the books are going to need to be retypeset, as additional text is going to spill over.

What is the largest errata so far that makes changes?

Lines of text and other objects in a PDF can easily be moved up or down.

Moving up where there is less text after the errata doesn't matter if the book will never see print again. Even if it does it will just be a little bit more whitespace on the page from the missing line or two in the section.

I recall using an OLD program on an Apple in school that was on 5 1/4 inch disks. Now assuming actual publishing software today is superior and not inferior to that product used to make simple school newspapers, then columns of text with margins set should easily be able to be make and adjust rather quickly as those decades ago, and can be printed to a PDF file with OCR or direct text inserted from the printer driver of the publishing software.

I don't see why it should be taking long to typeset anything when many newspapers are able to do it in a matter of hours, and today has vast more powerful technology than that of many decades ago.

edit: which book? The first listed errata for the PHB I have is page 42 and the racial trait to say "1 attack at-will power" yada yada. That also causes either a shift of lines, or a bit of overhang on the righthand side of the column.

 

[Dire Bare]

I don't see why it should be taking long to typeset anything when many newspapers are able to do it in a matter of hours, and today has vast more powerful technology than that of many decades ago.

Why do you think WotC will not continously in real time keep their D&D PDFs updated? Laziness? Spitefullness? Evil conspiracy to sell print books?

Scott Rouse has stated multiple times (which has been quoted in this thread) why this will not happen. Do you think he's just making stuff up to shut up the ignorant masses?

Just because YOU think it's easy and cheap to fix up those old PDFs every week or so as errata rolls in, doesn't make it true.

WotC COULD keep those PDFs updated each time somebody finds new errata. But it would require a WotC's staffers time to do it, time not spent working on the next D&D book or article. It's not something that would take just a few minutes, to do it right requires a reasonable amount of time and time = money. It just quite frankly isn't high enough on their priority list to spend this time & money, and quite frankly their priorities are in the right place.

 

[Angel Tarragon]

Scott, I've held off on buying the core rules. Now that I hear about the SE Core Books possibly containing errata I am wondering if there is any truth to this. I'd love to own the SE's but don't want to waste my money on them if they are going to be exactly the same as the first hardback run. Can you confirm if the SEs will have errata?

RPGnow and Drivethru will get the errata core book files next week. It shouldn't take them long to get them posted.

And what about the SE books?

 

[malraux]

edit: which book? The first listed errata for the PHB I have is page 42 and the racial trait to say "1 attack at-will power" yada yada. That also causes either a shift of lines, or a bit of overhang on the righthand side of the column.

Retraining [Revision]
Player’s Handbook, page 28
In the fourth sentence of the feat section, replace “heroic tier feats” with “heroic tier feats and paragon tier feats.”

 

[malraux]

I don't see why it should be taking long to typeset anything when many newspapers are able to do it in a matter of hours, and today has vast more powerful technology than that of many decades ago.

It also should be noted that newspapers have also developed a pretty detailed system to specifically cover rapid typesetting that works for newspapers, but wouldn't work for this.

 

[justanobody]

Why do you think WotC will not continously in real time keep their D&D PDFs updated? Laziness? Spitefullness? Evil conspiracy to sell print books?

Scott Rouse has stated multiple times (which has been quoted in this thread) why this will not happen. Do you think he's just making stuff up to shut up the ignorant masses?

Just because YOU think it's easy and cheap to fix up those old PDFs every week or so as errata rolls in, doesn't make it true.

WotC COULD keep those PDFs updated each time somebody finds new errata. But it would require a WotC's staffers time to do it, time not spent working on the next D&D book or article. It's not something that would take just a few minutes, to do it right requires a reasonable amount of time and time = money. It just quite frankly isn't high enough on their priority list to spend this time & money, and quite frankly their priorities are in the right place.

Yeah all Scott ever does is lie to everyone.

Note he also said that the department might could benefit from extra personnel anyway, meaning they are more than likely understaffed currently for that department like probably quite a few others after the recent incident and restructure.

Which means that with the proper staff they might just be able to do it. There is no reason a company whose products are largely or involve such great amounts of print material does not have a large enough staff to handle it in a timely fashion.

Retraining [Revision]
Player’s Handbook, page 28
In the fourth sentence of the feat section, replace “heroic tier feats” with “heroic tier feats and paragon tier feats.”

I may have missed an errata download then. Got to find that!

It also should be noted that newspapers have also developed a pretty detailed system to specifically cover rapid typesetting that works for newspapers, but wouldn't work for this.

See the above response to the first quoted portion. WotC does large amounts of work with printed products, so they should have the proper system in place to handle print products. Maybe not as large as a newspaper, but should be bigger than some fly-by-night company that doesn't do a lot of business. So they can insure quality products. Errata not withstanding I have read many threads about typos in general that indicates either more people are needed for that area of the publishing department to allow for more stages and eyes to see them, or just people better qualified to do it and other things as well.

I would prefer the one that doesn't take one person off one project to work on another as that could cause problems for both. So hire an extra hand or two to help with the publishing department in the fields needed.

Also I would wager the people at WotC in that department are paid a lot more than those for newspapers meaning some waste their that could be translating into lower paid people and more of them to allow for the tasks to get done quicker.

So hire more help.

 

[Jack99]

And what about the SE books?

It's been confirmed in another thread that they indeed have the errata included.