ahayford
First Post
Now that Paizo has their own brand with quite a bit of recognition, I'm not sure this is something they'd be interested in doing.
Pathfinder 1E Could Pathfinder take D&D's place...
- Thread starter VGmaster9
- Start date
Now that Paizo has their own brand with quite a bit of recognition, I'm not sure this is something they'd be interested in doing.
Agamon
Adventurer
But it's only recognition from people that know what D&D is and how PF relates to it.
I'm sure that if the brand were ever for sale and the price made sense to Paizo, it'd be a no-brainer for them.
This is increasingly becoming less true as Pathfinder grows. I'm not saying a Pathfinder brand is going to equal a D&D brand any time soon, but it can happen. It'll probably take years (if it happens), but it's far from impossible.
I introduced my kids to RPGs via Pathfinder a year or so ago. When we play, we're playing Pathfinder, not D&D. I'm now gearing up for my 3rd PF kids campaign as my eldest has brought in friends. They only know Pathfinder as well.
=========
I'm also confused by the recurring wishing/what-if-ing for the scenario where Paizo could acquire the D&D brand and fuse the brand with a PF2.0.
1. If you're a 4e fan, presumably you're happy with the game and have no reason to want it to change ownership. WotC is giving you the game you want.
2. If you're a PF fan, why do you care if the game is called Pathfinder or D&D? Isn't it the game that matters? Aren't the mechanics and the play style they support why your preference is for Pathfinder and not 4e?
3. The Pathfinder RPG is still in its childhood. It came out it when, 2009?!?! Are RPGers that addicted to the "new shiny"? 4e isn't much older and rampant Internet speculation aside, I don't think 5e is right around the corner.
I fervently hope Paizo's success continues like gangbusters and does so without the D&D brand. Make mine Pathfinder!
Agamon
Adventurer
Hmmm. It's not less true at all, at this point. If this was before Gencon, I would have asked someone that was going to go into the PFS room and see if he can find someone that doesn't know what D&D is. I'm not a gambling man, but I'd put everything I own and a lot I don't on that number being exactly zero. The D&D brand is just so much more older, widespread and known, especially in non-rpg circles...and that's the real reason it would happen.
If soft drink company X gets the chance to call their product Coca-Cola, they'd probably go for it, no matter how well they're already selling.
I'm certainly not championing such a thing, I could care less. And I don't think it'll happen, either, too many variables. I just think that if it was possible, it would happen. Just my opinion, I understand that it's arguable.
If soft drink company X gets the chance to call their product Coca-Cola, they'd probably go for it, no matter how well they're already selling.
I'm certainly not championing such a thing, I could care less. And I don't think it'll happen, either, too many variables. I just think that if it was possible, it would happen. Just my opinion, I understand that it's arguable.
Last edited:
Truth Seeker
Adventurer
If PF is the next evolution phase of gaming. Then so be it.
It is nature' way of replacment. Brands do not have a unlimited life on the shelves. We all know this...
That is all that can be said.
It is nature' way of replacment. Brands do not have a unlimited life on the shelves. We all know this...
That is all that can be said.
What feels more likely at this point is that WotC and D&D are moving the brand away from what we recognize as a traditional, table top pen and paper RPG supported primarily by a shelf full of printed books, and Pathfinder's growth is due in large part to Paizo exploiting that niche as WotC abandons it. This doesn't presage the downfall of D&D or the ascendancy of PAthfinder in a competetive sense; rather, the two brands are splitting off and Pathfinder is "becoming D&D" simply because D&D is becoming something else.
As to the issue of brand recognition: "D&D" as an important RPG/geek brand will continue for some time, but the more players move to Pathfinder or (especially) discovering TTRPGs via Pathfinder, the stronger that brand becomes. But, D&D's brand recognition outside of TTRPG gamers is due to media coverage and licensed products/entertainment. Until Pathfinder has a comic book, an animated series, some high-end action figures, a few C/V games and a major media controversy*, it will remain obscure to the general public.
That, of course, may be a good thing, as D&D always seemed to thrive in a small company headed by individuals who loved the game, rather than a corporate minded leadership.
* We could manufacture one! "Pathfinder Players: Threat or Menace? Film at 11!"
D&D is a brand. Pathfinder is not D&D. It is a derivative of the same system D&D 3e uses, but that has nothing to do with the brand.
Do I personally approach it like I do D&D? Yeah I definitely do because it's also a pnp rpg. Wonderfully for me it's also based on the same foundation as the RPG I've played for like 10 years. My players also think of it as D&D because we associate D&D with all the standards of a tabletop rpg. Is it D&D though? No I don't think so. It has it's own style and flavor that really isn't in line with what D&D was for me or what it is now (4E).
Just as an aside. Thank god for PF. I stopped buying books for 3E when all the complete books were being released because it was entirely superfluous to me. Paizo can look at the path Wizards took and choose differently. I love their design choices to avoid cluttering everything so extremely by using archetypes and alternate classes. It's difficult when to say 'no' though and I really hope PF doesn't just turn into 3E all over again.
I don't think Pathfinder will ever eclipse D&D though. They are targeting different markets within the same field. I don't think Pathfinder has the potential to take that slot unless WoTC has a complete meltdown and stops producing D&D material.
Last edited:
This is really well said, and I agree wholeheartedly.
That being said, over the past year I have completely converted over to Pathfinder, and I refer to it as such. If I tell someone what I play, and they don't recognize the name, I simply use the opportunity to tell them about Pathfinder. Do I compare it to D&D for them to use as a reference? Sure. But I will then go on to explain what some of the differences are, and why I choose the one over the other.
gamerprinter
Mapper/Publisher
Well I did say 'not the brand'. Sure D&D is a brand, but especially for us gamers who've been playing D&D a long time, D&D is almost an alternate name for fantasy RPGs. It will never eclipse D&D the brand per se. But it doesn't need to...
All I meant was they do need to be separated out.
I get what you mean though I believe. You mean basically Pathfinder is sort of wearing the D&D mantle even if it's not the one that made it. That Pathfinder could succeed the throne in a sense. I think it's possible but it will depend who you ask. I don't think Pathfinder will ever have the visibility or mass market penetration of D&D. It's great at what it's doing right now but I don't think it will ever have anything near the kind of awareness D&D has.
However, among board game players, card game players, pnp rpg players, etc. Pathfinder may well come to be seen as the 'standard' for pnp roleplaying. I think 4E was pushed much too hard and in reaction many have said 'no' and turned elsewhere. Certainly there's a reason WoTC decided to develop the Essentials line and push in that direction.
Similar Threads
