D&D 5E Counter-Attack Monk Build Ideas?

[doctorbadwolf]

I like that basic idea. I think the ki expense is too high for some of it, though. Looking at Deflect Missiles, you only spend ki if you throw the missile back, and looking at Open Hand, you spend a ki to Flurry, and just get the extra benefit for free. Generally, the satisfying Monk subclasses are the ones where you are getting more than just new ways to spend ki, so I'd look to do something like the following on a second pass:

Level 3: Stance of The Patient Tide. When you take the Dodge Action on your turn, you enter the Stance of The Patient Tide until the end of your next turn. While in the stance, you gain insight into any creature that comes into close contact with you. Whenever a creature misses you with a melee attack, they must succeed on a charisma saving throw or you learn their current HP total, and any damage resistences, immunities, or vulnerabilities they have.

The Tide Comes In. You can use your reaction to deflect a melee weapon attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level.


If you reduce the damage to 0, you can spend 1 ki do one of the following;

• Make a melee weapon attack against the target
• Move a number of feet up to your Unarmored Movement speed bonus
• Force the attacker to succeed on a Dexterity Saving Throw or be moved up to 10ft or any direction and knocked prone.

Level 6. Feel the Quiet River Rage. When you are in the Stance of The Patient Tide, you gain tremorsense out to 20ft, and can move up to 5ft any time you succeed on a strength or dexterity saving throw.

Level 11. idk

Level 17. Tidal Heart Beat When you use your Flurry of Blows or spend ki as part of the The Tide Comes In ability, you can feel the ki of a single creature targeted by the ability, feeling their heartbeat if they have one, or their mystical essence if they do not. Any time in the next minute that you use either ability against them again, you can spend ki to add additional damage dice equal to your martial arts die to a single damage roll against the target, ending the effect. You gain a number of dice equal to the number of ki you spend.

I'd like to finagle that a bit more to where you mark an enemy like in Tidal Heart Beat but with a much lesser effect very early on. I'll think on it and rework the abilities to use that psuedomarking mechanic early on, somewhere, but I do think the deflecting attacks thing should be at level 3 if possible, because it's situational enough that it isn't really equal to most level 6 benefits, and a slight buff to the dodge action isn't supperr beefy either.


His weapons aren't really the issue, but I'll check out the articles.

So, after a lot of thinking and tinkering, I have a few new ideas.

So, first, for monks in general I'd say they can spend 1 ki to do a special attack as part of an attack with a monk weapon or unarmed strike, rather than in place of it.

As for the Way of The Patient Tide, here is what I've got now;

Stance of The Patient Tide - Starting at level 3, whenever you take the Dodge Action, you can spend 1 ki to enter the Stance of The Patient Tide, which lasts for 10 minutes or until you end it, fall unconscious, or lose concentration as if concentrating on a spell.
While in the stance, you have tremorsense out to a distance equal to your Unarmored Movement speed bonus, and you gain a mystical bond with a creature you physically interact with, allowing you to hear their heartbeat, and exploit it. Whenever a creature misses you with a melee attack, they must succeed on a wisdom saving throw, or you learn their current hit points, and any damage resistances, vulnerabilities, or immunities they posses. You can also impose the save and gain this information by spending an attack as part of the attack action to take stock of your enemy's strengths and weaknesses.

Strike of The Tide Returning - Your perception of your enemies allows you to pull them out of balance when they strike, opening them up to a counter-attack.
Also at level 3, You can use your reaction to deflect a melee weapon attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level.

If you reduce the damage to 0, you can spend 1 ki to make a melee weapon attack against the creature that attacked you. (recall that this also means that you could instead grapple them, or trip them, etc. This will also get an upgrade later.)

Feel The Quiet River Rage - At level 6, your attunement to the bond of the Patient Tide increases. Every failed attack against you drives your opponent closer to the end. When a creature fails it's save from your Stance of The Patient Tide ability, and any time they miss you with an attack while under that effect, they take damage as if you'd hit them with an unarmed strike, as you use their anger and the mystical bond you've created to accelerate their heartbeat and bring them closer to death.
You can also enter the Stance without spending ki, as an action. You cannot do so again until you complete a long rest.

At higher levels you'd gain maybe more info from stance of the patient tide, perhaps know their emotional state, even surface thoughts?

Also, at high level, some kind of killing blow you can do to a creature under your bond, any time you could make a normal attack? Or perhaps even something using the exhaustion mechanic instead of bonus damage?

Anyway, in combat it probably needs some sort of active benefit when on the offensive, although the enemy taking damage any time it attacks you is good.

 

[Rune]

The specific character this is for makes sense to have levels of Rogue, but is mostly a Monk.

Right now he is a Drunken Master. Tipsy Sway is great against multiple enemies, but his backstory includes him being lethal in single (especially arena) combat.

What I’d love instead of Tipsy Sway is an expansion on Deflect Arrows. Parry as a reaction, spend 1 ki to counter attack.

I’d also like soemthing defensive at level 3, and perhaps something where you study an enemy? What if, when you take the Dodge Action, you can study a specific enemy, and gain a damage bonus next time you hit them before the end of your next turn?

The idea is to model the kung fu archetype of the patient defensive, often symbolically water based, martial artist who turns the enemy’s attack against them.

The character is also a very analytical fighter, who understands the movements and emotions of his opponents and uses that to take them down.

Any ideas on how to do this, both within what already exists, and what sort of abilities might go with it in a new monk subclass?

Way of the Mirrored Pool (Monk Subclass)

Level 3: Patient Readiness
When you ready an action on your turn, you may forgo declaring the action, but still must declare a trigger. Additionally, you may use a bonus action during the same turn that you ready an action. If you do not, you may use a bonus action in addition to another action (or movement) as part of your readied action.

Level 6: Quickened Readiness
You may use an attack action as a readied action and, thus, may make multiple attacks as part of your readied action. Additionally, you may both move and act as part of a readied action.

Level 11: Shield of Readiness
You may use your ki to project a shield of force as if casting the shield spell. This shield of readiness does not require vocal components, but does require 2 ki points to be expended. Additionally, if the shield of readiness is used while you have a readied action prepared, it does not use your reaction.

Level 17: Abundant Readiness
You no longer need to declare a trigger when you ready an action. As long as you have a readied action prepared, you may trigger it at any point before your next turn. Doing so may occur before, during, or after another creature’s action or movement, if you choose.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Way of the Mirrored Pool (Monk Subclass)

Level 3: Patient Readiness
When you ready an action on your turn, you may forgo declaring the action, but still must declare a trigger. Additionally, you may use a bonus action during the same turn that you ready an action. If you do not, you may use a bonus action in addition to another action (or movement) as part of your readied action.

Level 6: Quickened Readiness
You may use an attack action as a readied action and, thus, may make multiple attacks as part of your readied action. Additionally, you may both move and act as part of a readied action.

Level 11: Shield of Readiness
You may use your ki to project a shield of force as if casting the shield spell. This shield of readiness does not require vocal components, but does require 2 ki points to be expended. Additionally, if the shield of readiness is used while you have a readied action prepared, it does not use your reaction.

Level 17: Abundant Readiness
You no longer need to declare a trigger when you ready an action. As long as you have a readied action prepared, you may trigger it at any point before your next turn. Doing so may occur before, during, or after another creature’s action or movement, if you choose.

That is very cool, though I think level 3 needs at least a ribbon in addition to what’s there.

Also, all the well-received monk subclasses cost spells at 1ki per level, so I’d make the shield spell cost 1 ki, and you can spend a second ki to make it not use your reaction.

 

[Rune]

That is very cool, though I think level 3 needs at least a ribbon in addition to what’s there.

Level 3: Watchful Readiness
When you ready an action on your turn, you may also make a Wisdom (Perception) check to detect the presence and location of a creature you cannot see or a Wisdom (Insight) check to determine the intent of a creature you can see.

Also, all the well-received monk subclasses cost spells at 1ki per level, so I’d make the shield spell cost 1 ki, and you can spend a second ki to make it not use your reaction.

Good idea. Given that this is a reaction-focused class, that should work fine.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Level 3: Watchful Readiness
When you ready an action on your turn, you may also make a Wisdom (Perception) check to detect the presence and location of a creature you cannot see or a Wisdom (Insight) check to determine the intent of a creature you can see.



Good idea. Given that this is a reaction-focused class, that should work fine.

I like it. I’m not sure if it replaces or lives alongside what I was working on, tbh. I may save the whole “deflect arrows but for melee” thing for something else, maybe a feat that gives a couple ki and the choice of a few ki abilities...

 

[Rune]

I like it. I’m not sure if it replaces or lives alongside what I was working on, tbh. I may save the whole “deflect arrows but for melee” thing for something else, maybe a feat that gives a couple ki and the choice of a few ki abilities...

That would be a cool feat.

 

[Rune]

That would be a cool feat.

Could probably bundle in the Unarmored Defense, too. It would take a very specific kind of build to make use of it, but would be great for a dex-based non-monk pugilist.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Could probably bundle in the Unarmored Defense, too. It would take a very specific kind of build to make use of it, but would be great for a dex-based non-monk pugilist.

Yep, and work well for any build that wants some monk, but suffers for multiclassing or can’t afford to really boost Dex and wis. I’d definitely take it for a swashbuckler rogue, for instance.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Yep, and work well for any build that wants some monk, but suffers for multiclassing or can’t afford to really boost Dex and wis. I’d definitely take it for a swashbuckler rogue, for instance.

I wonder. Is that strictly better than defensive duelist?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I wonder. Is that strictly better than defensive duelist?

Probably. Defensive Duelist is terrible. I’d say it’s comparable to Magic Initiate and the class MC feats from Tashas, though.

Deflect Melee Attack and Unarmored defense at will, 2 ki and a couple ki abilities known (including the ki cost part of deflect), is probably in line with the race magic feats, at the most powerful end. Maybe still less powerful than them, tbh.