Counterspells

[Jack Simth]

Free action: your turn only; requires a readied action.

Immediate action: anywhere in the initiative, but only once per round, and you can't do certain other things the turn after you've made an immediate action.

Besides - do you really want a Sorceror with this spell line to be able to almost totally shut down multiple opposing spellcasters while still actively casting?

 

[Sravoff]

On second thought...... Perhaps make the spell a first level spell that counters a spell tat is one or more spell levels lower than it. Thus making the heighten spell a must.

This would also limit sorcers abuse, as they would be able to use it a bit much in my opinion. However, they can still counter cantrips, and they can ready actions to counter, and use the sudden heighten feat from complete arcane.

-edit-

Besides - do you really want a Sorceror with this spell line to be able to almost totally shut down multiple opposing spellcasters while still actively casting?

Right. :wink:
-/edit-
Just some food for thought.

-Sravoff

 

[Cabral]

The trouble is, that would mean a 3rd-level spell could take out 9th-level. I am not sure if that would be balanced or not, but I would rather end up underpowered then over.

Dispel Magic can take out a 9th level spell ... and it's more versatile about when it can do it.

I do like the idea of a bonus on the dispel check, at least for higher-level versions of counterspell against lower-level spells. For example, maybe Major Counterspell has to make a CL check against 4th through 8th-level spells, but automatically counters 0th through 3rd?

Thanks for the help.

Now that ithink about it even more ... Isn't there an improved counterspelling ability or feat where you can counter a spell with any spell of the same level? These spells could potentially diminish its value.

 

[Sravoff]

counter spell with same school instead of exact same spell. 3.5 PHB.

 

[asnys]

Dispel Magic can take out a 9th level spell ... and it's more versatile about when it can do it.

True... Alright, you have convinced me. I think I will still cap the spell level Counterspell can counter to 6th, though.
Also, think there would be any problem with upping the range of the spell to long?

Now that ithink about it even more ... Isn't there an improved counterspelling ability or feat where you can counter a spell with any spell of the same level? These spells could potentially diminish its value.

Yes, as Sravoff pointed out, but Improved Counterspell is an automatic success. Major Counterspell would tread on its toes a little, but an 8th level spell should be pretty powerful anyway.

 

[RangerWickett]

For the record, the only thing you need to up the usage of counterspells in your game is to have an NPC do it a few times. In one of my most successful campaigns, the first major encounter the 5th-level party had was against six 3rd-level knights and a 7th-level wizard who just held back and either counterspelled or reflected the PCs' spells.

True, I created some custom counterspells for that setting, including Overmaster, which let you take control of another's spell and retarget it. And the villainous organization had a huge 'we counterspell' thing going. But eventually the PCs wised to it, and asked how they could counterspell more. I let them take the Reactive Counterspell feat, modified from Forgotten Realms.

Basically, the FR version lets a spellcaster respond to any spell being cast by casting a counterspell of his own (Dispel Magic, or a direct counter), but in exchange he gives up his action for the next round. It had as prereqs Improved Init and Improved Counterspell. I required neither prereq, because I wanted counterspelling to play a major role in the game. I also let spellcasters use it for 'soft counters' -- things like hold person or silence that could stop a spell from being cast, but not necessarily be a counterspell.

Not everyone took it even then, because few of the spellcasters were built to be effective counterspellers. I figured that proved it was balanced. Fun game, it was.

 

[Stalker0]

Dispel Magic can take out a 9th level spell ... and it's more versatile about when it can do it.

Fireball can take out a 9th level spell, and its much better at it

You ready an action to throw your fireball when the guy casts. If you hit and he fails, that's an average of 35 damage on the caster. So...thats a 45 concentration check, which is hard even for a 20th level mage.

If you want to make counterspelling useful over other options the caster has, you HAVE to do one of the following:

1) Take away its cost, either in actions or in spell slots. It needs to be a free action, not costing any time to do. Or, it spends no spell slots when its used. A counterspeller can waste an opponent's spell while not hurting his own (this becomes nice for a high level caster to block a lower level one and save his strength for bigger fights).

2) Counterspelling can effect more powerful spells than the spellcaster can cast, and by effect I mean fairly consistently. If I'm going to be spending my actions and my spell slots when I could have been fireballing or feebleminding or summoning I had better get some bang for my buck.



If you want an example here's how Arcana Evolved does it. Counterspelling requires a feat, but its a lot more useful. You can ready to counterspell if a spell is cast (you don't have to target a specific person). When the spell is cast its an opposed caster check. You don't have to match a specific spell, you don't even have to identify the spell that's being cast. And...you lose no spell magic when you counterspell. Even further, there's a 3rd level spell that's lets you bump your caster level checks for 1 round/level...allowing a weaker caster to consistently counterspell a stronger on if he's got that buff on.