Coup de grace?

[Andrew D. Gable]

The rules say a thief's (whoops, rogue's) sneak attack damage applies on coup de grace attacks. What's everyone's concensus on an assassin's death attack? Would this apply?

 

[Epametheus]

Death Attack probably wouldn't be added into the coup de grace, and honestly is inferior to a coup de grace anyways. A dc of 10 + 4d6 or more + weapon damage will kill most people regardless.

Death Attack also seems to require to 3 rounds of set-up no matter what; there's nothing indicating that you get an automatic death attack even against helpless opponents, unless there's some piece of eratta of which I'm currently unaware of.

 

[Crothian]

Death attack is an instant kill. It's similiar to a cdg, but has different requirements for it to work.

 

[mmu1]

I'd say it'd definitely apply, if the assassin took the required time to study the target.

Of course, it is overkill of the highest order, and kind of pointless - given the requirements for becoming an assassin, the victim is going to be, on average, making a DC 30-35 Fort save. If the victim is able to make a save like that, you've probably got bigger problems than worrying about whether he needs to make a save againt the Death Attack.

 

[hong]

The rules say a thief's (whoops, rogue's) sneak attack damage applies on coup de grace attacks. What's everyone's concensus on an assassin's death attack? Would this apply?

A death attack is basically a sneak attack with some extra juice, but which takes some time to setup.

If the assassin doesn't take the 3 rounds to study the target, then it's just a normal coup de grace. The assassin's sneak attack damage would be added to the DC to survive, just like with any sneak attack + CdG.

If the assassin takes the 3 rounds to study the target, it counts as a death attack, and the target would have to make a save at DC 10 + assassin level + assassin's Int mod to survive. If they survive, it's also a CdG into the bargain, and they have to make another save at DC 10 + damage dealt (including sneak attack damage). Typically the latter save will be much harder than the former.

 

[Drawmack]

I would use one save whichever is higher. Then if the save fails I would apply CdG + SA damage.

Also don't forget that with a death attack the assassin must remain hidden from the target or unrecognized as a foe. By the time the guy is for a CdG this is probably not feasible.