Coward in our midst

[James Heard]

I'd just start moving the melee to the character whether or not he wants to participate or not. You know, make it so that the only way the fight's going to happen is if the critters attack the both of you. Consider it an object lesson on humility and respecting the suffering of others, since he's content to let everyone else suffer without aiding and thinks that he's above doing his fair share in combating evil.

 

[TheEvil]

No its just annoying be cause he hasnt died so he adds about 2-3 levels to our group level so we have to fight stuff thats way out of our league, he runs and hides, some of us die make new characters and he just keeps going up in level. Eventually well all be 5-6th average and hell be about 16 and we will have to fight stuff that will kill us with their bad breath and hell just run off again. I think others care about the problem too as its come up before. Were freinds so were not kicking anyone out, I think everyone else just deals with it and Im tired of dealing with it.

From a purely XP standpoint, the lower level characters, should gain xp quite a bit faster then higher level ones. Is the GM giving more XP to the low end characters? If this is done, you shouldn't get TOO far behind the survival monkey. What level does the GM have you bring new characters in at?

Another possiblity could be that you are in the wrong kind of game.
How important are the dice-driven aspects of the game vs. the purely roleplaying aspects? In other words, does the plot move ahead based on dice results or roleplaying results?
What is the actual character class/level spread?
What % of the game is spent on combat? Problem solving? Roleplaying?

I have been in games where asymetrical power wasn't a problem from a contribution standpoint, and one character being a combat monster wasn't a big deal. I have been in at least one other where it was a freaking nightmare. Granted, this isn't a perfect fit with the situation describe.

 

[TheEvil]

On an amusing note, I was in a game with another group. We added a player while in the middle of a swamp. His intro was that his previous party was wiped out by a hydra. 3-4 levels later, all but his character killed in a battle with a fiendish treant. New characters in hand, we proceeded to have several close calls, all of which he was in the best position to survive when it all hit the fan. Finally, myself and another player decided (in humor and good fun) that if we faced another near TPK situation, we would make sure that he was not the only survivor, even if we had to kill him ourselves. We spoke to the GM and let him know that we wouldn't consider any such death binding, just meant as a joke.

Mind you, he played well, was a solid contributer, and didn't shirk his part of a fight. He even ran into danger to pull PCs out when they went down, preventing several character deaths this way.

 

[gizmo33]

What I recommend is that you deal with this in what some people would consider an "adult" fashion - which may or may not be appropriate to your age group, but it's done as follows:

1. figure out what YOUR problem is. Forget about the other guy being at fault for a second. Figure out what you would want to be different.

2. Tell the DM and other players about it. Instead of "Here's why you're a jerk...". Say things like "Here's what I'm not happy about...". Only fools think they're 100% right about who is and isn't a jerk. What you do know is what you don't like. Stick with what you know. It really accomplishes the same thing in the end.

3. Listen to what everyone else has to say about this problem.

4. Figure out if there's room for comprimise, but don't force it.

5. Remember that other people can't MAKE you angry - your brain is in charge of interpreting people's actions, and the fact that you're not having fun is not worth BLAMING on another person. But it is worth recognizing, and it's worth fixing.

You might not get satisfactory results by talking to the players/DM and you don't have many options in that case - IMO it's not worth trying to manipulate, humiliate, or threaten a way to solve these things - although foolish people try to do this all of the time. They usually wind up drunk out in someone's yard screaming about something stupid. Don't go down this road.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

No its just annoying be cause he hasnt died so he adds about 2-3 levels to our group level so we have to fight stuff thats way out of our league, he runs and hides, some of us die make new characters and he just keeps going up in level. Eventually well all be 5-6th average and hell be about 16 and we will have to fight stuff that will kill us with their bad breath and hell just run off again. I think others care about the problem too as its come up before. Were freinds so were not kicking anyone out, I think everyone else just deals with it and Im tired of dealing with it.

Let's see here: Assume you are a party of four. If he is raising your average party level then he has to be 8 levels higher than the rest of you.

First off, if this is true you don't have a player issue, you have a DM issue - this is insane.

If the problem character is bringing the party up by two levels, then you do not have to fight anything out of your league for you to get XP, although it will be easy for him.

Example:

Four party members: 3rd level
Average level: 3rd level

XP for one CR1 creature: 300 XP
XP for one CR2 creature: 600 XP
XP for one CR3 creature: 750 XP

Three party members: 3rd level
One member: 11th level
Average level : 5th

XP for one CR1 creature: 300 xp
XP for one CR2 creature: 500 XP
XP for one CR3 creature: 900 XP

As you can see, you can fight creatures within your ability, even with only three active party members and still get XP, maybe a little less than you would if you were all the same level, but not that large a difference.

So, all you need to do is refuse to take on anything that is too tough for you. If your DM won't let that happen, then once again you have a DM issue, not a player issue.

 

[Wraith Form]

I may volunteer to run a game and that will be the end of the problem and hopefully everyone else will get the picture. In my games you get reputations people talk, the villagers who you were saving will remember you fighting valiantly and they will tell the tale. The cowards get forgotten or they are remembered hiding with the women. Xp is based off of participation and role playing, heroes who die heroicly are not punished and cowards rewarded.

Funny, you gripe about his character's cowardice but yet you won't talk to him (or the DM) outside of the game. Sounds pretty hypocritical.

Harsh of me to say that? Probably, but that's the perception I have reading your posts. Every time one of us suggests you speak to him (or your DM) it sounds like you come up with excuses why you shouldn't.

So gather up some balls and talk to them, or stop accusing someone else of cowardice that you're exhibiting yourself. Then everyone can kiss, make up, and be happy again!

I also agree with what others have said: your DM sounds like he's got his head up his poop-shute if he doesn't STOP rewarding cowardice during battle...

 

[Storyteller01]

well, if he gets to 16th level, and y'all die, won't your new PCs come into the game around 14th level (-2 levels from the lowest PC)?

Certainly it's a player issue. I'm a big fan of escalation. Make it so it's an unavoidable conversation/conflict.

Meaning, the next time you get to a battle where he is NOT helping, call a time out. Ask him directly, "why is your character not helping us?"
he'll probably give some answer that won't matter
next question: "why should I fight this if he's not helping?"
another answer that won't matter
next question: "why is he still in the game if he's not helping everyone else?"

ultimately, by having the conversation WHILE the bad behavior is happening, the rest of the group will be in the heat of the moment and be likely to agree with well framed questions. This will put slacker-boy on the spot. People need to be put on the spot when they're not pulling their weight.

You may have to come close to driving him out, in order to get him to join your game. He's not really there anyway, so what's the loss?

And there's the ultimate nail in the campaign coffin last response: "I don't see the point in playing a cooperative game where everybody isn't having fun" then get up and leave. You haven't quit the group, you've made a statement about the current situation.

By your example of his character, he has the power, and he's using the party to do all the work. Your character can't beat his. He uses this fact to get his way. therefore, take it out of the game, where he has no more power than you.

Dunno, manipulation of this magnitude can easily backfire if you aren't careful. Besides, your playing a very risky game for a comparatively minimal reward.


I agree with the 'it's a player issue' camp. Talk to the group, voice your opinion. Or, at the very least, tell the DM that you don't believe his characters level should be considered when he averages out the parties level. This should help create encounters that the rest of the party can deal with.

He may be able to easily beat critters at your level, but MAYBE he'll join in combat this time. Not to mention, his exp and treasure rewards will be lessened regardless of his participation. It shouldn't effect you so much, since your fighting at your character's level of conflict.

 

[Prince of Happiness]

It's a test from Ilmater to see how much suffering your paladkensaiter can take.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

It's a test from Ilmater to see how much suffering your paladkensaiter can take.

That's pretty funny.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Actually, that is another perfectly valid way of treating this in game. A holy test...I like!