Crafting with hirelings using aid other

[IcyCool]

if anyone has problems with 69 dwarves, anyone know of good crafting rules that dont wast feats and makes craft a usefull skill? I found a usefull and ecnomic way to use craft although its not the most realistic, but i dont think it is as far out as everyone thinks.

Masterwork or magical tools, anything that gives your skill a bonus. Or, if you don't want to spend the time, look into the Fabricate spell.

 

[pawsplay]

You can help another character achieve success on his or her skill check by making the same kind of skill check in a cooperative effort. If you roll a 10 or higher on your check, the character you are helping gets a +2 bonus to his or her check, as per the rule for favorable conditions. (You can’t take 10 on a skill check to aid another.) In many cases, a character’s help won’t be beneficial, or only a limited number of characters can help at once.
In cases where the skill restricts who can achieve certain results you can’t aid another to grant a bonus to a task that your character couldn’t achieve alone.

Probably the most efficient thing is to be very skilled, hire a bard to inspire you, hire five helpers, purchase a +30 competence item, and use a masterwork forge.

You can't make a dwarvencraft item unless you are a dwarf, and only dwarves can aid such endeavors, per above. It's a cultural thing. If you want to devise an alternative that does basically the same thing, talk to the GM about a custom feat.

 

[pawsplay]

What if a hireling fails on the aid other (dc 10) is it fair not to pay him/her? What kind of question is that? How would you know whether the hireling failed a roll? That's metagaming. You hire the person to do a job, he does the job, you pay him.

It's never a good idea not to pay a dwarf.

 

[Ilium]

It's never a good idea not to pay a dwarf.

QFT

Also, since they only have to make a DC 10, they won't fail. They'll just take 10. Unless the GM purposely puts a slacker into the mix for story purposes, of course.

 

[IcyCool]

QFT

Also, since they only have to make a DC 10, they won't fail. They'll just take 10. Unless the GM purposely puts a slacker into the mix for story purposes, of course.

Well, they can't take a 10. (See the sentence in parenthesis just before the bolded sentence in pawsplays' post).

 

[Ilium]

Well, they can't take a 10. (See the sentence in parenthesis just before the bolded sentence in pawsplays' post).

Ah. Makes sense I suppose. Even so, I assume you'd hire people who know what they're doing. Even if they're first level they'll have a modifier of +5 or more. If they're actually competent (third level with max ranks and skill focus) they really can't fail. But of course they'll cost a lot more tha 3sp a day.

 

[Moon-Lancer]

Ah, i got it, i will just call it fey craft. Seriusly, anyone see a balance problem with a book adding effective feats to races after the races has been printed? That alone seems broken to give that to only dwarves, after dwarves are already the strongest race, yet no one has problems with dwarves, even though they are nigh high broken. It would be like retroactively giving all elves racal weapons like court blades and thin blades and light blades. If it was elven craft, everyone would jump be really angery, and throwing a fit (like im doing now). It seems like something that would be done in 2.0, not 3.5. Dwarven craft only seems balanced if anyone can learn it, even if dwarves start with it pre learned.

i guess paying or not paying them really isent a problem.

4 skill ranks, +2 for dwarf, +2 from feat +2 masterwork tools or forge. a 10 every time.

 

[taliesin15]

first thing that crossed my mind is whether having a bard nearby encouraging the crafting of this weapon would help--perhaps a good chunk of the 69 hirelings would be a baker's dozen or two of bards, continually plying their trade...ok, a bit absurd, but then again it all kind of points out some of the problems with the system--in this case both with bards, and with Craft...

 

[Moon-Lancer]

i dident think bardic music stacked with other bardic music, but omg, hireing one bard for bardic music is a awsome idea. Thanks. I like the flavor alot.

 

[Storyteller01]

i can see using 69 people to make one weapon, though i have never made a weapon in real life, but a few people could keep the forge hot, a few others could hold the sword in place to pound the steel, others could run the sword to the forge to the anvil and back.

I've never heard of more than 5.

1 to keep the forge going, 1 to hold the blade, 3 the beat the metal (timing is key here), 1 to craft the furnashings (grip, pommel, cross guard).

I wouldn't use it for making a weapon, but it might be useful for mass producing weapons (4 to a forge).


A bit of a side topic: how would you folks feel about applying this to a factory situation? Steel mill work and such? Applying employee +2's to the foremans skill (he's overlooking the work, and will take the biggest hit if production doesn't cut it).