crappy players question/rant

[jollyninja]

ok, the group of players i have right now is great with one possible exception. two of the players in the group seem to be more and more often taking out of game disputes into the game. first, any advice on how to stop that? there is the obvious talking to them about it, which i have tried, both claim it's all in character but i get to hear the whining after the games from both of them and it's clearly not all in charater. the characters hate each other, this is indisputable fact, one is a red robed tower mage and the other an annointed knight with a few exalted feats. the red robed mage has killed one of the other player's characters earlier in the campaign (at least, he did more then half the required damage to kill the character with an errant lightning bolt, not the killing blow though and the player was talking about a new character anyway) and that grudge has never gone away. since, that player has threatened many times to kil the mage with his succession of new characters ( he has a new character every month or so anyway). there have been a few points where i would not have even blinked if the party turned on the mage and hacked like there was no tomorrow but recently a trip to the abyss, followed by a brush with death has given the mage a clear new outlook on life. he has been acting more selflessly and helping the party and others alot more regularly (the player decided he wanted to switch robe colors to white) and then the main problem player is now talking about killing the mage and having his character walk. normally i would let him do it and then throw the little disruptive jerk out of my game but we play at his house and the other campaign in which i am a player is also at his house. i honestly think the player with the mage has done little but play his character the way he sees him, he even tried to kill the mage with his other character once because that was what the other character would do.

any ideas?

 

[Crothian]

Tell them to stop. If they still claim it's all in character, tell them to stop that too. If they are doing things that causes you to not have fun, tell them. Don't except anything other then an agreement to change. IF they don't change, stop the game and point it out and refuse to continue.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Hi jollyninja,

That's a tough one. Here's a possible thought and idea.

It sounds like the mage has at least gone someway to helping you out but the other guy wants to really hold onto the grudge. I suppose what you want to do is cool things down so the spotlight of the game is on something else other than them.
Do your best to shift the focus from them to a different player character. Have something dreadful happen to this other PC - despicably evil and unfair even. This will shift a little angst from the knight and wizard back onto you as the DM. People will see your action as being a little harsh and possibly even unfair. However, you provide a possible remedy to the situation that requires all the characters to team up together. In particular, the mage will be required to achieve this difficult task. You try to inspire a little team spirit and make it foolish to kill the one member who is going to be able to help.

This could backfire and create a huge mess if the Knight still wants to take down the wizard. However, you have a littel leverage in terms of the Knight being an Exalted character. An exalted character must always be ready to forgive and offer redemption if it is asked for - which is something this soon to be white robe is heading towards.
If the player goes against all of this and still kills the mage, then you have a hard decision to make. If the guy playing the Knight is going to continuely unsettle the enjoyment for all, then you will have no choice but to stop the game and work out the differences before continuing. If this can't be done, you may be faced with a tough decision to remove the Knight's player. If this means gaming elsewhere, it's going to be really tough. In the end, it comes down to how sensible everybody wants to be. I hope for your sake, the player can play his exalted character correctly and get on with the game. Post back if I have not understood the situation correctly.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Djeta Thernadier]

Well, I have to agree with Crothian. Tell them to knock it off, in game and out. Explain that it is ruining everyone's enjoyment of the game and if they insist it is in character then give them the choice to create another character. If they refuse have the entire group discuss it and discuss whether or not they want these two in game if it continues.

It sounds like the mage did not intentionally kill the other PC. It also sounds like your group did not start off as a group where the intent was every player for himself and PCs killing PCs. I know some people like to play that way. I don't, myself. I think the whole point is the party getting along at the very least and not fighting amongst themselves. Then it becomes competitive between players and that's not fun for me.

DO these two just live for PC vs. PC combat?

Sounds like it isn't fun for you & the rest of your group, either. Explain that to these two, if it is indeed not the way you want your group to be run, and if these two insist that they want to be in a PC vs PC type group, they can find a group suited to that need.

Of course, if your whole group wants to play this way, you might want to find a different group yourself.

Or, if you're the DM , make a new house rule...no PC vs. PC combat will be recognized or tolerated. Take away XP if they try.

Overall, it's your choice. It's very hard to change someone's playing style. You have to decide whether or not staying in this guys group is worth the annoyance of having him try to kill other party members.

Good luck.

 

[jollyninja]

just a little clarification, my group is decidedly against pc vs pc combat. there is just a huge difference in the personalities of the two players. and the seperation between reality and my game is blurring. by the time the mage lightning bolted the psion (not a class even generally allowed in dragonlance but the guy really wanted to play one, it was a telepath, he got kind of irritated when the mage took things like dominate person and such claiming his character had been made useless) it was allready the player's second character and he had allready tried to suicide the character in a roleplaying situation. he essentially suicided his cleric, the first character, by rushing into melee combat without any buffs and intentionally getting himself seperated from the party. when the wizard hit some pc's with a lightning bolt, the only time he has used his magic to directly harm another pc, the party was getting wasted by the half fiend straight from the MM with a different spell selection and it was his only attack spell left.

 

[Iron_Chef]

Tell them to stop.

Actually, I'd tell them to _______!