Creating a PC - What if you don't know who's on your team?

[Chainsaw]

So, based on what I've read here at ENWorld and my limited experience playing, it seems that 4E's mechanics overtly emphasize teamwork. Assuming that's the case, which is fine, what if you're creating a character for a campaign where you can't predict what your team's role composition will be? Maybe this week there's no thief, maybe next week no leader, maybe the next week no controller? Do you just accept the potential for a suboptimal composition and go have fun with whatever concept you've dreamed up?

If so, I'm totally cool with this approach. Real life is kind of like that and memorable situations can arise because of it. Still, if anyone's had experience planning for this unpredictability when creating a character, I'd love to hear it. Is there any skill you think's absolutely essential, for example? Important enough to risk, say, using a feat to train in it just in case no one else has it on a particular game night?

I ask because I've recently joined a Living Forgotten Realms pick-up campaign. The size and role composition of the party in any given week can be pretty varied (except levels).

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

Even if you don't know what role composition the party will have, make whatever class you want; In a setup like LFR, it probably won't hurt anything. Say you make a Ranger. And everyone else at the group makes rangers. A party of 3-6 Strikers is still a valid party, it's just that your tactics will be different. Same for a party of Paladins (although their tactics will be different from an all-striker party).

You don't need all the roles, but you do need to know what tactics to best use with the roles you get.

 

[Pbartender]

So, based on what I've read here at ENWorld and my limited experience playing, it seems that 4E's mechanics overtly emphasize teamwork. Assuming that's the case, which is fine, what if you're creating a character for a campaign where you can't predict what your team's role composition will be? Maybe this week there's no thief, maybe next week no leader, maybe the next week no controller? Do you just accept the potential for a suboptimal composition and go have fun with whatever concept you've dreamed up?

I'm not sure you'd be able to do anything but.

If I was the DM, and knowing that 4E is geared this way, what I'd do is have each player create several characters (ostensibily one of each of the four roles, but that might be a bit much). This might represent the combined talent of a larger organization -- an Adventuring Guild, for example. Each game session, the players would put together a party with each player choosing of their four (or however many they've made) characters, and filling whatever roles are necessary... In a way emulating the Guildmaster picking and choosing the best available people to do a given job.

The potential downside is that you may regularly end up playing different characters from session to session. The upside is that you always guarantee that all the roles will be filled.



Of course, a Living campaign is a whole different ball of wax.

 

[-Avalon-]

My suggestion is a lil off from that lol... with no idea what the role comp is going to be, plan for the unknown... that is to say, make a character who has extreme survivability, or make a character who has "get out of jail free" cards built in...

Suggestions:
Cleric - the best healer in game IMO (heal yourself when needed)
Paladin - a lot of HP/AC plus heals (good combo)
Battlerager Fighter - Keeps on trucking through Temp HP gains
Rogue/Ranger - Tons of Maneuverability and "invis"ish abilities
Warlock - tons of ports (play Feylock obviously)

Do something like that... that way if stuff gets hard or bad, you can always survive and get the heck outta dodge at any moment =)

 

[Chainsaw]

You don't need all the roles, but you do need to know what tactics to best use with the roles you get.

Terrific point. Thanks Silverfrond.

 

[Mengu]

As a DM, my philosophy is play what you want. It's the DM's responsibility to provide appropriate challenges.

Having said that, as a player, it is more fun to have at least some coherence in the party composition. A party of twin striking elf rangers is not quite as enjoyable as a more diverse party. As such, I do encourage my players to diversify and allow them to talk about the roles they'll be playing.

 

[Chainsaw]

As a DM, my philosophy is play what you want. It's the DM's responsibility to provide appropriate challenges.

Having said that, as a player, it is more fun to have at least some coherence in the party composition. A party of twin striking elf rangers is not quite as enjoyable as a more diverse party. As such, I do encourage my players to diversify and allow them to talk about the roles they'll be playing.

I totally agree. My issues are a) since the DM's running Living Forgotten Realms modules, his ability to modify them is more limited b) even if he could modify them, he never REALLY knows who's playing until they sit down at the table that night.

 

[Chainsaw]

@Pbartender: That's an interesting idea. LFR does allow me to create as many characters as I want (well, maybe not really, but enough). Maybe I'll talk to the DM about that. Only problem is that I have the potential to level really slowly, heh. But hey, it's not about winning, right?

@Avalon: Thanks for the suggestions. I only had a few minutes to make my character, so I'd chosen a sword/board fighter and used his two feats for perception and thievery. It turned out to be fine b/c the group had a fighter, a warlord, a ranger and two wizards, but afterward I started wondering.. what if? Incidentally, I plan on exploring the build options a little more once I learn the rules better.

 

[Pickles JG]

If I was the DM, and knowing that 4E is geared this way, what I'd do is have each player create several characters (ostensibily one of each of the four roles, but that might be a bit much). This might represent the combined talent of a larger organization -- an Adventuring Guild, for example. Each game session, the players would put together a party with each player choosing of their four (or however many they've made) characters, and filling whatever roles are necessary... In a way emulating the Guildmaster picking and choosing the best available people to do a given job.

The potential downside is that you may regularly end up playing different characters from session to session. The upside is that you always guarantee that all the roles will be filled.

In practice this is what has happened round here for our LFR - everyone has several characters & every team ends up pretty balanced. It was not like this back in my Living Greyhawk days (4 wizards, a bard & a rogue being a particular low point, especially for the rogue).

My assessment which is very IMO not supported by much IME is

You can have too much ranged but not so much too much melee. I would make a melee character or a hybrid rather than a ranged one (ie Battle cleric not laser, melee capable ranger not pure bow)

Warlords seem to benefit most from specific pair ups & are markedly less useful in some groups rather than others & so I would avoid them. Rogues too like a melee buddy but can be pretty good at arranging sneak attacks (& one melee buddy is all it really takes).

Wizards are a little low in defence & the ability to kill fast. I think they too benefit from a team they can help in specific ways (but I have not seen many in action)

Multiclassing for healing power will help cover leaderless situations. Toughness will help smooth the bumps too.

Otherwise I think that you can get away with pretty much anything because any mix of roles is viable if stressful sometimes (3 rangers & a rogue was interesting).

 

[Mengu]

I totally agree. My issues are a) since the DM's running Living Forgotten Realms modules, his ability to modify them is more limited b) even if he could modify them, he never REALLY knows who's playing until they sit down at the table that night.

The necessary tweaks should be minimal. No leaders? Add some healing potions and insert a healing fountain somewhere. No Strikers? Chop off some HP's from brutes and solos. No Defenders? Play the monsters a bit dumber so they don't gang up on one character.

As long as there are 4-6 players, you shouldn't have an extremely polarized group, so the adventure shouldn't need too much tweaking. Absence of one or two roles is quite managable on the fly. It is not much different than adjusting the adveture for one fewer or one extra player.