Creating RPG Rules Systems

[Davaris]

I have seen a few books on creating adventures, campaigns and worlds, but have seen no books about creating original rules systems for RPGs. So I was wondering has anyone seen anything like this?

 

[Nadaka]

I have a few...
Discreet Math
Linear Algebra
Statistical Analysis

Ok, so they cover a lot of the theoretical concepts. But no real examples or advice when it comes to gaming.

 

[jdrakeh]

There really isn't such a thing, to my knowledge. The thing is, there are as many ways to design game systems as there are people on planet Earth. To wit, some games use cards, some use dice, some use colored stones, some don't use randomizers at all. Some games define characters with numbers, other with words, some with picture and even lumps of clay. Some games are about resolving tasks, other about resolving scenes, still other about collaboratively creating stories.

If I were you (and I was, once) I'd go check out The Forge and Story Games. More open design goes on at these two sites than any others that am aware of (i.e., designers do step by step design on the forums, post playtest files for download, have brainstorming sessions, etc). Be warned, however -- there is also a lot of potential boobery at both of these sites. The trick is to take the good and leave the BS, though it's up to every individual to decide what constitutes "good" and what constitutes "BS" (sometimes the line between the two is fine).

Good luck, and welcome to game design! Have fun (because God knows there's not very much profit in it)

 

[Davaris]

There really isn't such a thing, to my knowledge. The thing is, there are as many ways to design game systems as there are people on planet Earth. To wit, some games use cards, some use dice, some use colored stones, some don't use randomizers at all. Some games define characters with numbers, other with words, some with picture and even lumps of clay. Some games are about resolving tasks, other about resolving scenes, still other about collaboratively creating stories.

Perhaps this could be something someone could write? I think it would be fascinating read, if it looked at lots of RPG systems and broke them down into their components and looked at how well each works in the particular game genre and system it was designed for. I don't think it would sell a lot of copies, but I think there'd be lots of kudos from within the games industry if the book was good.

EDIT:
Then you could use these components to randomly generate rules systems, much like those random adventure generators can be used to create adventures. A book like that would be fantastic.

If I were you (and I was, once) I'd go check out The Forge and Story Games. More open design goes on at these two sites than any others that am aware of (i.e., designers do step by step design on the forums, post playtest files for download, have brainstorming sessions, etc). Be warned, however -- there is also a lot of potential boobery at both of these sites. The trick is to take the good and leave the BS, though it's up to every individual to decide what constitutes "good" and what constitutes "BS" (sometimes the line between the two is fine).

Thanks I'll try them out.

Good luck, and welcome to game design! Have fun (because God knows there's not very much profit in it)

Thanks. Yes I know about that. Unfortunately I have no choice in the matter.

 

[xechnao]

It depends what game you are trying to create. How will it be supposed to play. Then you create the rules to fit your gaming concept. Obviously you must have some experience.

 

[Nadaka]

It depends what game you are trying to create. How will it be supposed to play. Then you create the rules to fit your gaming concept. Obviously you must have some experience.

I would not say that experience is necessary. but it does help. Anyway, here are a few more resources.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNS_Theory

http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/columns/physics31oct03.html

http://www.skotos.net/articles/BSTG_44.shtml

 

[MarauderX]

Check out how some of the XP point buy systems have been formed around other games. It will give some good insight into how things are weighed for balance, such as the 3.0 Ranger. Another thing you may want to get good at is spreadsheets - they will save you time and effort once you get the basics in.

According to James Wyatt, Bill Slavisek is the one and only numbers guy for 4E. For those of you with a profession that goes on numbers, you know how important it is to have someone double check what you are doing (see Mars probes gone awry).

 

[Scurvy_Platypus]

A couple of years ago, a fellow by the name of John Kirk tried something interesting; he took a look at game design through the lens of software development.

While it garnered criticism for various reasons, it's one of the few examples I know of where someone has very deliberately sat down and attempted to deconstruct some of this stuff in a systematic fashion.

I'd say it's at least worth a read and even if you don't agree with what you find, it might help get you started along the direction you want to go.

You can find it here:
http://legendaryquest.netfirms.com/

Click "downloads" in the top frame, and scroll down to the bottom. "Design Patterns of Successful Role-Playing Games" is what you're after.

I could offer all kinds of advice about places to go look, things to try, and all that, but really... there's not much point. This sort of thing is art and like art, there's only some elements that can be taught. The rest is a matter of a person sitting down and doing hard work. Your best classroom? Sitting down with different games, and running them. Playing them too, since things look different depending on which side of the screen you're on.

That's assuming your game is going to have a screen.

 

[Davaris]

Scurvy_Platypus:

I just found that through this page

http://www.darkshire.net/jhkim/rpg/theory/

http://legendaryquest.netfirms.com/books/Patterns.zip

and was about to post it but you beat me to it!

Its a large volume coming in at 261 pages and looks like it fits the bill. Like the author I'm a programmer so I can see where he is going with the design patterns concept.

Thanks everyone! I've got some reading to do.