Cure x Wounds - Explain this

[Thraxus]

Level 1 Fighter
Con of 15
Max hit points at first level
Has 12 hit points.

Is reduced to 1 hit point in combat. DM describes his injuries as horrible gaping wounds that are bleeding badly. His companion, a Level 1 Cleric, helpfully casts Cure Light Wounds on him, luckily rolling an 8 and thereby healing 9 points of damage. The Ftr has gone from 1/12 hit points to 10/12 hit points. DM describes the Fighter's wounds closing until they are merely minor flesh wounds.

Much later..

Lever 5 Fighter (same guy)
Con of 15
Max hit points at first level
Avg hit points all other levels
Has 42 hit points.

Is once again reduced to 1 hit point in combat. DM again describes his injuries as gaping wounds that are bleeding badly. His companion, now a Level 5 Cleric, helpfully casts Cure Light Wounds on him, and once again rolls an 8, thereby healing 13 points of damage. The Ftr has gone from 1/42 hit points to 14/42 hit points. The DM describes several of the Fighter's wounds closing somewhat, but states that he is still seriously injured.

Why? Just a side effect of the abstract nature of the hit point system I guess. The same spell can bring a Level 1 character from the brink of death to almost complete health, but when cast on a higher level character in the same condition, has a much lesser effect. From a rules and game balance standpoint, it makes perfect sense. From a realism standpoint.. well.. it doesn't.

Bob the Lvl 1 Cleric, who tends to the spiritual needs of a small hamlet, once used Cure Light Wounds to completely heal all the wounds inflicted by a rabid wolf on little Timmy the Lvl 1 Commoner. Little Timmy only had 1 hit points and the wolf had reduced him to -4 hit points. However when Sir Valiant the Lvl 10 Paladin was left lying in an almost identical state of health (negative hit points) by a rampaging pack of Worgs, that same divine energy was only barely able to stabilize the hero.

Am I nitpicking this point? Certainly. Do I really think it matters in the grand scheme of things? Not really. But it does poke a hole in the ability of players to "suspend disbelief". Anyone want to put forth a rational explanation for it?

Cure Light Wounds is great
To heal injured commoners
Heroes get the shaft

~ Haiku by Thraxus

 

[EricNoah]

Just a side effect of the abstract nature of the hit point system I guess.

Yep!

 

[Victim]

Well, there are a number of explanations.

SOme people will describe HP as partially health and mostly "lifeforce." The greater heroes have purified their essence, or whatever, so it takes alot more magic to fully restore their lifeforce.

Also, higher level characters might have some kind of magic resistance. That's why they can eat fireballs that kill most people. BUt it also means that healing magic is less effective as well.

Sir Valiant the level 10 paladin kept fighting through wounds that would kill normal men. His strength of spirit sustained him as he fought. When he's at negative HP, maybe he's sustained so much damage that his body has catastrophic injuries, instead of the 2 bites it took to knock out his squire.

 

[Umbran]

I'm not sure that this shouldn't be over in the Rules forum, but anyway...

My question for you is... is the problem wiht teh spell,. or with the DMs description of the results? Is it the spell, or how you view hit points that is the problem?

Imagine if you will, the cases you describe above, with teh following alteration:

"The Ftr has gone from 1/42 hit points to 14/42 hit points. The DM describes the Fighter's wounds closing until they are merely minor flesh wounds. However, there is a lingering stiffness, bruising, and general muscle fatigue that keeps him from performing at his best, making future mortal wounds more likely..."

The thing to remember is that hit points do not directly represent bodily damage. They represent a compound of ability to take physical damage, combat skill at avoiding actual blows and damage, and general epicness. The high level fighter is not that much more physically hardy than his 1st level counterpart. But he has skills and abilities the low level fighter cannot match. His ability to use those skills gets worn away in a fight. He gets deep muscle fatigue, uses up luck, etc.

So, while CLW may cure the same amount of gross body trauma, it is not so good at healing up those other factors. Remember that if you want characters that can regularly fight demons and dragons, "realism" shouldn't be the most prominent item on the menu

 

[Nightfall]

Hey if you want to see something worse happen to that fighter than just a bloody gash, let me sic a juvinenal red dragon on his butt! Can anyone say extra crispy?

 

[LostSoul]

You explain it by having the DM give different descriptions of what's going on.

Example 1 sounds good.

Example 2... not so good. The Fighter should have his cuts and scars healed, but his muscles are weak, his mind is tired, and he's still out of breath. He can't use all those nifty little tricks that he's learned over the past few levels to keep him alive anymore.

 

[Numion]

Example 1 - The fighter has taken one good hit from a greataxe. The spell mostly heals the hit.

Example 2 - The fighter has taken four good hits from a greataxe. The weak cure spell cures only one and a bit of the next.

You see, the 5th level fighter was more injured. Thats why a single spell couldn't heal him.

 

[DWARF]

Then...

Use the Gram 'n' Gritty system. I think a good increase in the realism factor would be an all skill-dependant (BAB, saves, it all is skills you can raise with Xp) system using the Grim 'n' Gritty hit point system.

But that's just me...

 

[LostSoul]

Example 2 - The fighter has taken four good hits from a greataxe. The weak cure spell cures only one and a bit of the next.

You see, the 5th level fighter was more injured. Thats why a single spell couldn't heal him.

This still doesn't explain how the fighter lived through four times as much damage as he could at 1st level.

 

[hong]

Anyone want to put forth a rational explanation for it?

Not me.

Suggested fix: change d8 + 1 hp/caster level to d8 + 1 hp/healed character level.