D&D General D&D: Literally Don't Understand This

[dragoner]

Dungeon Crawl Classics has explicitly leaned into that aesthetic, but I suspect its audience skews older, even if there are younger players in the mix.

A zoomer isn't going to be "Dude, this is like the cover of that Molly Hatchet album!" Same as the Chevy dealership doesn't have a Berlinetta Camaro on the lot. Time moves on. For a lot of us, and I have played 5e, AD&D is the ultimate edition, so we're out of the target audience anyways.

edit:
Cover added for reference, D&D's aesthetic isn't it's own, it just tapped into what was popular in the 70's. It has built on it since; though for new customers, they aren't going to get it the popular culture it arose from.

 

[TiQuinn]

Oblique? It seemed very direct.

I mean the tweet was relying on the alt text for the keyword to make it pop up at all in that context. How were they trying to associate it to the album? What were they trying to say about D&D?

Again, I kind of think it was a throwaway tweet and this is all a mountain made out of a molehill, but did I think it was effective marketing? I don’t think it was, IMO, but maybe they have numbers that show otherwise.

 

[Gradine]

I generally don't like to assume people are intolerant.

I don't like to do it either; I'm much happier giving people the benefit of the doubt. For some of us, though, identifying red flags and listening to people when they tell you who they are is literally a survival tactic.

Edit:

It adds up. Give folks some credit for seeing a pattern, even if you didn't.

This, basically

 

[Umbran]

Taylor Swift + Referencing one of the worst selling books that WOTC has made to date...

Citation on that, please? Thanks much.

While you get that, we can also remember it...

... was #2 in Publishers Weekly's "Best-selling Books Week Ending July 29, 2022" in hardcover nonfiction.
... was nominated for the Nebula Award for Best Game Writing in March 2023.
...was nominated for the Diana Jones Award for Excellence in Gaming in June 2023.
...won the 2023 Silver ENNIE Award for Best Adventure and was nominated for Best Product.

So, hardly a sad-sack of gaming.

 

[Nikosandros]

Yikes.

There's bad and there's awful. This is firmly in the latter category.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

As for what is happening here, at least one person in this thread is insisting that this is about more than shoes - it is about a perceived list of modern elements. And there have been threads upon threads about how modern art direction with tacos in Hero's Feast isn't acceptable. Or about how a modern approach with non-evil orcs isn't acceptable. How the overall modern game design away from lethality is unacceptable....

It adds up. Give folks some credit for seeing a pattern, even if you didn't.

Seems like a rather weird "pattern" to me. Whilst I am sure there are indeed people who don't want modern elements in their fantasy settings, want evil orcs and lethal combat, these are three completely separate issues. I for one have different opinion on all three of them. I am not sure it is useful to conflate them in such way that you'd assume opinion on one would tell anything about the opinion of the other two, let alone on something more nefarious like some have implied.

Not saying that people with crappy opinions do not exist. They obviously do. But I don't really believe that someone saying that they do not want fantasy-starbucks in D&D is some sort of a dogwhistle for something else.

 

[Umbran]

I mean the tweet was relying on the alt text for the keyword to make it pop up at all in that context. How were they trying to associate it to the album? What were they trying to say about D&D?

Again, I kind of think it was a throwaway tweet

I imagine it was a quick way to get algorithms to show company content a little more often, is all. If it is saying much about D&D, it is that it is also a pop-culture icon, and welcomes all types.

...but did I think it was effective marketing? I don’t think it was, IMO, but maybe they have numbers that show otherwise.

The question is if it was cost-effective. And it was pretty much free.

Honestly, when you think of how often the posts have been referenced by haters*, and what quoting typically does to an account's relevance as far as algorithms are concerned? It probably had a larger-than-expected effect.


*"And the haters gonna hate, hate, hate, hate, hate". Amirite?

 

[TiQuinn]

I imagine it was a quick way to get algorithms to show company content a little more often, is all. If it is saying much about D&D, it is that it is also a pop-culture icon, and welcomes all types.



The question is if it was cost-effective. And it was pretty much free.

Honestly, when you think of how often the posts have been referenced by haters*, and what quoting typically does to an account's relevance as far as algorithms are concerned? It probably had a larger-than-expected effect.


*"And the haters gonna hate, hate, hate, hate, hate". Amirite?

All totally fair. This is why I am definitely not a marketer!

 

[Not a Decepticon]

So, someone who doesn't like high heels in D&D doesn't like women?

I mean when people are mocking these high heels using template from a comics by a self-admitted nazi, I won't blame anyone for going to such conclusion.

 

[Angus MacDeth]

Nobody has used that explicit phrase within this thread, no. But I didn't make it up. It is in other social media a lot the past few days, though it has been around for quite a while now.

As for what is happening here, at least one person in this thread is insisting that this is about more than shoes - it is about a perceived list of modern elements. And there have been threads upon threads about how modern art direction with tacos in Hero's Feast isn't acceptable. Or about how a modern approach with non-evil orcs isn't acceptable. How the overall modern game design away from lethality is unacceptable....

It adds up. Give folks some credit for seeing a pattern, even if you didn't.

Maybe it isn't just about shoes after all. Maybe shoes are a symbolic of something bigger.


EN World is demonstrably not an island, separated from the rest of the gaming world, or the rest of the real world. You cannot expect that folks will leave the rest of their experiences at the door when they come here. And when what is said here echoes what it said out there, folks will make the connection.

You'll have some hard work to do to prove there is no connection, despite the evidence folks see.

I generally don't engage with other forms of social media, eschewing Facebook, Twitter, and the like. Also, I haven't read "threads upon threads" about the modern art direction of D&D; I've only read this one.

So, while I'll concede that there may be some previous pattern of behavior that I haven't been privy to, I've only been commenting on what I've seen in this thread and what seem like ridiculous leaps of logic conflating "I don't like this art" with "that must mean you hate women, people of color, and LGBTQ folks!"

I don't think anyone had said anything insensitive or that indicated a lack of empathy in this thread (at least not up until that point), but I'm definitely not interested in proving anything to anyone or trying to disabuse anyone of the conclusions they've drawn from outside evidence.