D&D's Obelisk Plotline Was Supposed to Be Resolved in Vecna: Eve of Ruin

The plotline was dropped when Chris Perkins' job responsibilities shifted away from game design.
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Chris Perkins has revealed that the obelisks scattered throughout various 5E adventures published by Wizards of the Coast was originally supposed to play a central role in the Vecna: Eve of Ruin adventure capping off Fifth Edition. Many Dungeons & Dragons adventures published for Fifth Edition featured mysterious black obelisks. These obelisks were revealed to be capable of time-travel and were tied to a mysterious group called the Weavers as well as the Netherese Empire. In Rime of the Frostmaiden, it was revealed that Vecna had obtained one of these obelisks and it was hinted that Vecna would use the obelisks in his plot to rewrite all of reality.

Vecna's possession of an obelisk was never followed up on, but it was apparently supposed to be a plot point in Vecna: Eve of Ruin. In a recent interview with Polygon, Perkins provided his vision for Vecna: Eve of Ruin. "The original plan, in my mind, was that we would actually culminate the story by going back in time to fight the Netherese Empire,” Perkins said. “It was always on our radar to bring Netheril back in some way. And this was the way I envisioned it happening, because the only way you could really fight Netheril again is to travel back in time."

“I was excited about the idea of a time travel adventure,” Perkins said later in the interview, “simply because it would feel very different from the other campaigns we had done up to that point. And I thought given time and attention, we could do some really fun things with Netheril and explore a style of magic that felt different from contemporary magic. Expedition to the Barrier Peaks would be sort of like the vibe I'd go for, where the magic is so weird it almost feels technological.”

Unfortunately, plans changed when Perkins' role at Wizards of the Coast shifted in his latter years with the company. “The reason it was dropped was that different people were in charge of the adventure design,” Perkins said. “I had rolled off a lot of my hands-on product work to help out with other parts of the business. And so, when I creatively walked away from the day-to-day adventure creation, we sort of lost the plot.”

Polygon has been periodically publishing interviews with Perkins, including an introspective on Rime of the Frostmaiden, and some insight on 5E's adventure design.
 

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Christian Hoffer

Christian Hoffer


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This article is very interesting. I had always suspected that 5e’s big-honking-adventure books were backdoor setting guides. Tyranny of Dragons and Princes of the Apocalypse don’t really fit the pattern, but they were the first two such adventure books for 5e. Starting with Out of the Abyss, which was pretty transparently built like “everything you need to know to run adventures in the Underdark” with the plot mostly being an excuse to tour the PCs around the major Underdark cities. Curse of Strahd was the Ravenloft (though limited to Barovia) source book; Tomb of Annihilation was the Chult sourcebook; Dragon Heist and Mad Mage were Waterdeep sourcebooks; Descent into Avernus was both a Baldur’s Gate and Nine Hells sourcebook… Storm King’s Thunder and Witchlight don’t fit the mold quite as cleanly, but the intent is clearly there with a lot of them.

This also explains why those campaign books all feel like they have paper thin plots to me. As Chris says here, they focused on the locations first and then came up with reasons for the players to need to go there after. That results in them all being “and then” stories, instead of “but/therefore” stories. The motivations feel weak because they’re just excuses to get the party to the next location the designers had already decided they were going to go. Needless to say, I do not share Polygon’s apparent adoration for this approach to adventure design. Seeing that they have taken a different approach with Adventures in the Forgotten Realms gives me hope that maybe they’ve moved on from this experiment and will try writing future adventures with the primary goal of being good adventures instead of that being secondary to the goal of being secret setting guides.
Agreed. I'd note that The Wild Beyond the Witchlight had an Extra LIfe-funding supplement that's available on both DM's Guild and D&D Beyond, Domains of Delight, which essentially is the remaining setting material that didn't make it into the book. While I'd still have loved to see a more fleshed out Feywild setting showing domains like Mithrendain and Mag Tureagh, I've got my 4E books for that, and Lorwyn: First Light seems to be an additional supplement trying to fill some of that gap too (they outright state that you can treat Lorwyn as if it's the Feywild as a way to tie it into the FR campaigns books – they say best if you take a planar crossing from the Moonshaes. In any case The Wild Beyond the Witchlight was at least at one point intended as their Feywild version of this same sort of half-setting. And it was after Witchlight that the next two adventure paths were just straight up campaign settings.

Storm King's Thunder has a gazetteer chapter that takes up a good chunk of the book, and it directly supplements the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide by hooking in elements from that book into the events of its adventure. So I'd argue that it's also playing mini-setting role.
When it works, it's great. When it doesn't work, well, you get Strixhaven, which doesn't really function as a setting book or as a campaign.

Hey hey, I loved the Strixhaven campaign book!

The setting also had a full set of Magic Story chapters set on campus, and a full Planeswalker's Guide to Strixhaven, in case you needed more material to build off of. We're going back there later this spring with Secrets of Strixhaven, and there will certainly be a Planeswalker's Guide to Strixhaven, Edition 2.0 or whatnot reframing the setting after the cataclysmic Phyrexian Invasion of the Multiverse, and the subsequent opening of Omenpath portals between planes that anyone can traverse (no longer need to be a Planeswalker or be summoned through a planar gate to get to campus). Strixhaven always had been sort of a hub world setting like Ravnica because students came from all over the multiverse to study there. But the Omenpaths make that much more feasible rather than exclusive to those who had the means to planar travel.

Don't a lot of the Adventurers League seasons correspond with the big campaign book for the year?
If so, this would set up a payoff for the AL players at least.
They were, until 2021's Witchlight Carnival, when AL decided to retire their separate adventures documents and just run the main WotC campaign book, or a modified version of it with only parts in PDF form. Icewind Dale was the last season to have its own dedicated content, and even there it was only a handful of adventures.Tyranny of Dragons through Descent Into Avernus there were dozens of adventures for each WotC-campaign book season (plus a handful for Tales from the Yawning Portal as they didn't realise that was more of an anthology than a full season's worth of content to build off of).

The Moonsea was the living Forgotten Realms setting shaped by the Adventurer's League story. There are other Living FR areas – The Border Kingdoms basically are provisionally off-limits to allow Ed Greenwood & his friends to keep telling FR stories over there. The Moonshae Isles were in a similar boat with the Moonshae Regional Guide and adventure path on DM's Guild being semi-official, but as that path ended years ago the Moonshaes became open again for business in last year's two setting guides.

Oh, but I guess Spelljammer Academy sort of counts as an AL tie-in to Spelljammer. It's just… it was a temporary "claim this!" article available only to D&D Beyond and only if you didn't miss the window like I did. And it wasn't published by the AL, so I stand by my statements above! ;)
 



Hey hey, I loved the Strixhaven campaign book!
You also have a lot more familiarity with the setting than people like me, who picked up the Strixhaven book hoping for a magic school setting (which it doesn't do, unless you want to make your own setting doc pulling more details out of the adventure).

When WotC is charging ~$50 for a book, the answer should never be "well, this book is obviously incomplete unless you go and pick up additional products." Bonus content, sure. Content that I'd argue is necessary to run the book as promoted, no.

Strixhaven clearly had a messy development process, though, and isn't really typical of WotC books over the last few years, IMO.
 


Both reference The North and Savage Frontier products.
Yes, that's true, and the gazetteer in Storm King's Thunder overlaps with -- and in some cases overrides -- the gazetteer in PotA. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the setting info in those books is lifted almost verbatim from the older content.

I personally enjoy more setting info rather than less, but I realize that is not the way the wind is blowing these days.
 

Yes, that's true, and the gazetteer in Storm King's Thunder overlaps with -- and in some cases overrides -- the gazetteer in PotA. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the setting info in those books is lifted almost verbatim from the older content.

I personally enjoy more setting info rather than less, but I realize that is not the way the wind is blowing these days.

I didnt check line for line but yeah its similar.

Interesting to see tge progress between editions though. Seeds i. 1E or 2E terminated a decade later.

Until 4E blew it up. No sunrise on the backlash.

Some places were just a spot on a map. I think theres a megadungeon mentioned multiple times but no one's ever featured it. Multiple mentions back to 1E.
 


If there was a planned metaplot seeded in multiple books its a shame it didn't at least get a resolution, but I don't think it was a good idea in any case. Like if Chris Perkins was my DM and planted seeds for a future campaign through like five or six different campaigns, and we actually got to do them all, I'd think it was the coolest thing ever (well, coolest thing other than just having Chirs Perkins as my DM), but that doesn't really translate into published campaigns to be run by people who don't know about that payoff.

One of my pet peeves with the 5e campaign books is there are lots of elements that are just there to be easter eggs for people who read X Forgotten Realms novel or played Y Adventurer's League module, which is awesome in a piece of conventional media. But in a published campaign where everything is filtered through a DM and the table, extraneous things are going to be lost or reappropriated, and just add extra burden for a DM to figure out what a mysterious piece is doing as they make the module their own. Trying to secretly foreshadow and plant seeds for some sort of infinity stones-esque metaplot is just going to cause more trouble of this sort.

And this goes to a larger issue of communication. I love the idea of them designing adventures "place first" so that they can really be setting guides that just have a plot there if you happen to want it, but they don't actually present them as that or provide very good tools for using them outside the provided plot (not the ones I've read anyway, albeit with some exceptions like the Underdark travel chapter in Out of the Abyss). The semi-secret obelisks metaplot seems like a prime example of how a "campaign books designed for reading" ethos just buries all the great material for actual tabletop gaming in these campaigns under a lot of extra work to harvest.
 

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