D20 or HERO or TriStat: what I have picked

[PCD]

A couple of preliminary points:
1. One will not find the *perfect* game system.
2. All that matter is that you are having fun. To get that point, it is all about choice, interest, need, style, taste and want.
3. Be nice in this discussion. I am testing your loyalty to a game, to a degree; but be nice. The mods can close it if they feel that *fun* of this thread has disappeared.

Over the weekend, I picked up HERO and BESM TriStat. My history with D20 goes back to when it came out, so I didn't need to read up on it. BESM was interesting, but I simply could not put the HERO book down! I read it through, reread some parts and thought about it a lot.

I am officially a convert to HERO. Here's why.

1. I really enjoy the "building blocks" mentality. The Pros of this is that it allows more choices, more flexibility and more versatility. I started to get tons of ideas of *how* to make the kind of character I've always wanted to play. The Cons of this is that it takes awhile to learn, one can spend a lot of time thinking and working on a character and finally, one can be overwhelmed about the number of options that are available. You know what? All of this was a bit of adventure, a quest and I didn't mind it all. It got my creativity up and running!
2. It is all in one book. I didn't read the book and immediately think: "I need these other books, I want to buy these adventures/modules/settings and I need to think who will want to play what..." I read the book and saw that the classless, lack of linear progression and limitless multigenre potential was refreshingly...*simple*. I didn't have the need to go out and buy a book on one aspect of the core book, just to get clarified/expanded/optional rules. This was awesome.
3. D20 is good, but the fact that most people think this way is because it was fueled by D&D and the Fantasy Genre. Ironically, Modern got me to thinking about flexibility and versatility. I wanted to make something different and on my own and to not use rules that left me with a cookie cutter setting. Can I make anything equal to or great than Greyhawk? Nope. It would be perfectly clear I was trying to copy rather than present an original idea. D20 is geared towards copying...not originality: IMHO. TriStat is damn good, but I found it too much about copying (Anime Movies) and difficult to conceive anything original outside of that very diverse/huge genre.

Anime and Fantasy are rooted in Folktales or Myth and there are only a few archetypes in which to use. HERO is rooted in Comics/SciFi and there archetypes waiting to be discovered...or made. I believe this because the "building block" nature allows infinite "end results". Though, those "end results" might have familiarities-at first glance, closer observation just might reveal the nuances and quirks of something that is indeed original.

Pete

 

[mmadsen]

1. I really enjoy the "building blocks" mentality.
2. It is all in one book.
3. D20 is good, but the fact that most people think this way is because it was fueled by D&D and the Fantasy Genre.

I can agree with your first two points -- those are both strengths of Hero -- but your third point implies that there's no all-in-one d20 superhero game with a "building blocks" mentality. Isn't that what Mutants & Masterminds is?

TriStat is damn good, but I found it too much about copying (Anime Movies) and difficult to conceive anything original outside of that very diverse/huge genre.

Wait, you bought Big Eyes, Small Mouth? Why didn't you buy Silver Age Sentinels? That's their superhero game -- and it meets the criteria you laid out above.

 

[PCD]

I can agree with your first two points -- those are both strengths of Hero -- but your third point implies that there's no all-in-one d20 superhero game with a "building blocks" mentality. Isn't that what Mutants & Masterminds is?

Wait, you bought Big Eyes, Small Mouth? Why didn't you buy Silver Age Sentinels? That's their superhero game -- and it meets the criteria you laid out above.

M&M IIRC, isn't technically "D20". In fact, it encouraged me further down the Point/Buy Road. M&M is great for the Comics Genre. M&M is pretty good for the Sci Fi Genre too. Though, it does a miserable job for depicting ordinary folk. For Comics, I am more Dark Horse's "Sin City" than JLA; though I am inspired by both. "Marv" is believable, "Superman" is cinematic. For Sci Fi, I am more Herbert's "Dune", than Lucas' "Star Wars; though I am inspired by both. "Paul" is by far a more interesting character than "Anakin" anyday.

BESM TriStat was in the store at the time. I wanted to get my hands on the TriStat rules fairly quickly. Great book...I like it. Though, it should be labeled "Big Eyes, Small Mouth, Smallest Print". laffs.

Like I said, I wanted something rooted in the Comic/SciFi Genres; but with a limitless potential of Multigenre games.

Yeah, I might be complicated.

 

[Thanee]

Good choice, HERO rocks!

But d20 is a very, very good system as well (don't think one of those is "better", they are too different to each other).

Bye
Thanee

 

[PCD]

Agreed.

Though, I really wanted everything in one book-that I wanted to do and I found HERO offered me this capacity.

 

[Thanee]

Still need 5th edition myself. Only got 3rd and 4th I think (4th BBB being the same as the 3rd BBB just with "nicer layout").

Bye
Thanee

 

[PCD]

HERO 5th Ed is the first of HERO I have bought and read. So far, so good. The index is very good. Nothing worse than a book with a poor index or a book without an index altogether.

 

[Sir Whiskers]

I have to agree with your general premise: If I can only choose one system, I'd go with Hero, hands down. Fortunately, I don't have to choose.

 

[PCD]

Fortunately, I don't have to choose.

You are lucky. I had to start prioritizing my finances a bit and just don't have the throw away cash like I once did.

 

[collin]

!

Over the weekend, I picked up HERO and BESM TriStat. My history with D20 goes back to when it came out, so I didn't need to read up on it. BESM was interesting, but I simply could not put the HERO book down! I read it through, reread some parts and thought about it a lot.

I am officially a convert to HERO.

Pete:

I have to say that I agree with you on your points. I started playing Champions back around the time it first came out, around 1981 or '82, and I loved it! I liked the fact I could create whatever kind of character I wanted (the building blocks) and not have rely on the 'luck' of the dice to get me where I wanted to be (or not). I think you could taylor any kind of magic system/effect with the Hero system quite easily.

The d20 system has been a success for me because for the first time since I started playing D&D back in 1st edition, I can follow the rules reasonably well and understand what's going on. I used to love to play D&D but never bothered to read the rules because they were so complex and all over the place. Now we have a more streamlined system, but the minutia that goes with it keeps building, so it's becoming difficult to keep up once again.

Another thing I always liked about the Hero system was the phase/segment turn-based system of combat. For the life of me I have never found another game system that laid out combat so neatly and organized as Champions. I also liked the Body and Stun points concept of splitting the damage instead of having just one damage stat (i.e., hit points).

One thing our group tended to do to makes things go easier and quicker is we usually ignored the Endurance (END) stat. You still needed to have some character points devoted to it, but we rarely paid attention to it, unless a character had been going all-out for a while, and then the GM would say, "Okay, you're probably pretty tired now, so we're going to start counting END if you continue to keep doing stuff."

Keep us posted on how your fantasy gaming experience goes with the HERO system.

-Collin