D20 taking over?

[Flexor the Mighty!]

I would like nothing more than to see the day when there is no engine but D20.

Why?

 

[Wild Karrde]

D20 becoming the dominant system is fine by me. D20 becoming the only system truly frightens me.

As one poster said I can't imagine a supers D20 game. I guess we'll see how it works once it's finished but until then I'm very skeptical.

And if they are the only system we're gonna lose alot of versatility and imagination. My group likes to play games with different mechanics as a nice change of pace. Give you time to re-energize and get some fresh air in between the Star Wars and D&D D20 games.

 

[saduff]

Chaosium and Pinnacle producers of Call of Cthulhu and Deadlands both like their own systems better than d20 rules. They have stated on their sites as well as producing new supplement that will be dual stat'ed.

I was reading the BRP Call of Cthulhu and the d20 both of which I own. This one instance in the BRP book said that the player would gain 5% mythos skill which is the same one point in the d20 system. After some more reading I beleive that the BRP will prove to be more like the d20 system as far as chance and math is concerned.

Although the d20 system is far more easier to learn and understand than the BRP system.

 

[Corinth]

Why?

Because I have yet to find any RPG that couldn't be done just as well, if not better, as a D20 product. Yes, even Exalted and Feng Shui.

 

[EricNoah]

I know that I love discovering a new game and learning how that system works. Playing with a different set of rules, for me, is almost as important and invigorating as using different character concepts.

And for me it's just the opposite. A new system is a major impediment to me wanting to play and especially me getting my players to invest the time and money. For me and my group, at least, new game systems are something to be avoided.

BUT.... I am not one of those people who thinks that your desires have to go unfulfilled so mine can be met. If we can both have what we want, so much the better.

 

[Wild Karrde]

Because I have yet to find any RPG that couldn't be done just as well, if not better, as a D20 product. Yes, even Exalted and Feng Shui.

I think it's gonna have a tough time matching any type of point buy game such as HERO or GURPS. Wether you love these type of systems or you hate them one thing is for sure, you don't have near the flexiblity with D20 as you do with these. And since that is the attraction to these types of games I have a hard time seeing D20 do it better...differently yes but not better.

 

[Corinth]

(Double post)

 

[Corinth]

I think it's gonna have a tough time matching any type of point buy game such as HERO or GURPS. Wether you love these type of systems or you hate them one thing is for sure, you don't have near the flexiblity with D20 as you do with these. And since that is the attraction to these types of games I have a hard time seeing D20 do it better...differently yes but not better.

The flexibility isn't as strong a point as you think. By their own admissions, both games admit that most character do fall into an identifiable archetype or two. As "archetype"="class", neither of these two engines--in practical gameplay--do any better to make and play characters than a D20 game. Furthermore, classes are preferred by most gamers over point-based construction engines like GURPS and Hero; Joe Gamer wants little more than a bit of customization to taste, not to spend lots of time building it from scratch.

Then there is D20's powerful network externality, which is the edge that breaks all ties in D20's favor, which means that all a given D20 product has to do is be just as good as the non-D20 version and it wins in the marketplace because there is nothing to stop the D20 network from adopting the D20 product while there is a big barrier for the non-D20 version. Early adoption equals bigger marketshare equals more sales and greater profits. To not go D20 is questionable, at best, unless there is something external factor that prevents such a transition.

 

[Psion]

I think it's gonna have a tough time matching any type of point buy game such as HERO or GURPS.

What's to "match"? Point based systems are more flexible. They are also more tedious and have no structure built in to encourage logical characters. 6 of one; one half dozen of the other.

Wether you love these type of systems or you hate them one thing is for sure, you don't have near the flexiblity with D20 as you do with these. And since that is the attraction to these types of games I have a hard time seeing D20 do it better...differently yes but not better.

Oh, I love HERO for its flexibility. The thing is, that flexibility comes at a price. It takes some mathematical acrobatics to get some effects to go. And some players can't do that, and even if they don't do the work themselves, they suffer for not fully understanding the implications of their character's abilities.

The thing is that d20 isn't doing the same approach at all. Games like GURPS pretends that it can handle anything by adding the right skills, advantages, disadvantages, and options. But it only does this so well. IMNSHO, GURPS does an okay job at relatively realistic modern and sci-fi settings. But it falls flat when it comes to more cinematic and fantastic settings because it doesn't make the necessary changes.

d20 doesn't try to do that. Anyone can make almost any changes that they need to fit it to a setting and still call it a d20 system game.

 

[Wild Karrde]

What's to "match"? Point based systems are more flexible. They are also more tedious and have no structure built in to encourage logical characters. 6 of one; one half dozen of the other.

This can be said of any system and is usually the GM's responsibility. If I want to play a Chaotic Evil Drow Elf in a group of lawful Good Humans then I don't think you'd let me.


Oh, I love HERO for its flexibility. The thing is, that flexibility comes at a price. It takes some mathematical acrobatics to get some effects to go. And some players can't do that, and even if they don't do the work themselves, they suffer for not fully understanding the implications of their character's abilities.

I forget that most people cant multiply 50 by 1.75 that is pretty complex now that you mention it. Sorry to be so sarcastic but I always hear this argument and it's just not true. I've played with some major retards who seem to be able to do the Champions math just fine. If you're over 12 it shouldn't be a challenge if it is then you need to do fourth or fifth grade math over again.

d20 doesn't try to do that. Anyone can make almost any changes that they need to fit it to a setting and still call it a d20 system game.

This can also be done with any game unless I don't understand what you are saying.