Darkness+Devil's Sight is killing my campaign

[Felonious Monk]

I believe that's incorrect.

Read the Warlock class description. As has been posted the last couple times this was discussed, the Warlock class specifically mentions these feats as being useable, as "they do not increase spell level." Right?

Which brings into question the use of other metamagic feats which do not affect spell level.

The Sudden feats are on page 83.

 

[Diirk]

You will do more damage to them then they will do to you and if their buddies try to help out, they could still accidentally hit their ally.

Only ranged attackers can accidentally hit their allies in a grapple. Melee attacks suffer no such impediment.

 

[KarinsDad]

Right.

Complete Arcane, page 71.

I hate when they have exceptions to the rules hidden somewhere.

Complete Arcane, page 7.

"Metamagic feats cannot improve a warlock's eldritch blast (because it is a spell-like ability, not a spell). However, the feat Ability Focus (eldritch blast) ..."

That is such a pain in the butt. They should have put this exception that Warlocks could use these right in the Sudden XXX Spell feat descriptions (i.e. it would have taken no real effort to state "any spell or any spell-like ability" instead of "any spell" in the descriptions).


Thanks for pointing out the obscure exception to the general rules guys.


Btw, some of these feats are somewhat screwed up anyway.

Sudden Still Spell works for Warlocks (as does most of the other Sudden XXX Spells).

Sudden Silent Spell does NOT work for Warlocks (since they have no verbal component as specified on page 72).

Sudden Quicken Spell does not work very well for Warlocks since he has to take two totally worthless feats (Quicken Spell and Sudden Silent Spell) as two of his prerequisites, plus he has to take 4 other Sudden feats. He might as well take Quicken Spell-like Ability (one feat total) which has no feat prerequisties and can be done 3 times per day (and can be acquired at an earlier level). The only advantage Sudden Quicken Spell has over Quicken Spell-like Ability is that it can be done for higher level spells. I'm not sure that that is ever worth four once per day feats (several of which will rarely be use most days) plus two totally worthless feats that cannot be used at all unless he multiclasses (and he would have to multiclass a lot to use Quicken Spell).

Plus, Sudden Quicken Spell does not work that great for other spell casters either since it has 6 prerequisites, 5 of which are Sudden (and hence, usable once per day and then, not most days). This is practically worthless for anyone except a Wizard and even so, using up 7 feat slots to get one specific once per day cool feat is pretty costly. I suspect that any PC spell caster that attempts to eventually take Sudden Quicken Spell will have a much harder time surviving to ever get it, just because he has virtually no feats at low to mid levels (course, a DM could just hand these feats to a higher level NPC).

 

[Particle_Man]

I suspect that any PC spell caster that attempts to eventually take Sudden Quicken Spell will have a much harder time surviving to ever get it, just because he has virtually no feats at low to mid levels (course, a DM could just hand these feats to a higher level NPC).

Agreed. I think that it is used precisely for the NPC encounter when the BBEG starts quickening that highest level spell. And the DM doesn't want to worry about other stuff too much.

 

[Sithobi1]

The only advantage Sudden Quicken Spell has over Quicken Spell-like Ability is that it can be done for higher level spells. I'm not sure that that is ever worth four once per day feats (several of which will rarely be use most days) plus two totally worthless feats that cannot be used at all unless he multiclasses (and he would have to multiclass a lot to use Quicken Spell).

Unfortunately, Quicken SLA cannot be used on all SLAs usable by the possessor of the feat. You have to choose 1 SLA to quicken 3/day.
Edit: Does quicken SLA get rid of the somatic component?

 

[purespoo]

Don't forget that Devil Sight only covers darkness and magical darkness. It does not cover illusions or other physical obstructions.

An illusion in magic darkness is still perceived as an illusion. They would also need 'Witch's Sight' in order to see through that.

In an end all case, fog cloud and smoke will also work as a countermeasure. You don't need to see the area your casting in to summon a cloud of smoke. Even if it is darkness, all they would see is fog. Even if you can't see in the fog, you still can buy yourself time by hiding in it. Position the warlock in an attack in dense outdoor fog. He/she tries to cast it and ends up blinding everything including himself.

 

[Dandu]

Your response is illuminating.

 

[Greenfield]

Darkness is a 1st level spell/invocation.

Continual Flame, as used to create the common-as-dirt ever burning torch, right out of the Player's Handbook, is a 3rd level Light spell. Cancels the Darkness spell/invocation automatically.

<Edit> 3rd level Cleric spell, 2nd level Sorc/Wiz spell. Still stops Darkness</Edit>

In some of my games I, as a player, had my character use the Heighten Spell feat to create ever burning torches with 4th level Continual Flame spells, so they'd take down Deeper Darkness as well

Extreme problem solved by extremely common item.

 

[Dandu]

I prefer to cast Magic Missile.

 

[YOGZULA]

i'd have disallowed the power gaming 1 point warlock point dip if nothing else