Decline of RPG sales

[GMSkarka]

No offense, but why are your and eyebeams' posts always so negative? Or am I just reading the negative ones? Apologies in advance for possibly overstepping the bounds of Morrus' living room. :\

Um....What?

I made ONE post to this thread, and it was to post a joke about the nature of gamers to debate everything to death. Lighten up.....

Jeez....jump on people much?



As far as why eyebeams posts are negative (and, not coincidentally, why I haven't participated in this thread's main debate)....generally it's very frustrating to work in the industry and have people who don't (and who only know what corporate PR and personal anecdotal evidence tells them) insist that they know what's REALLY going on, and you don't.

 

[Belen]

As far as why eyebeams posts are negative (and, not coincidentally, why I haven't participated in this thread's main debate)....generally it's very frustrating to work in the industry and have people who don't (and who only know what corporate PR and personal anecdotal evidence tells them) insist that they know what's REALLY going on, and you don't.

The funny thing here is that your main source of evidence always revolves around the C&GR figures, which do not count online or bookstore sales.

I would agree that I see a decline in the hobby, especially among the gamestores. However, unless someone throws out some concrete numbers or facts or let us know what leads you to your conclusions, then people will not listen. So people consider your statements just as anecdotal because they cannot see where you're coming from.

 

[buzz]

Jeez....jump on people much?

My statement was based on a general trend I've seen in posts in various threads on various fora. Granted, it was probably not appropriate for me to bring it up, but I guess I was curious.

As far as why eyebeams posts are negative (and, not coincidentally, why I haven't participated in this thread's main debate)....generally it's very frustrating to work in the industry and have people who don't (and who only know what corporate PR and personal anecdotal evidence tells them) insist that they know what's REALLY going on, and you don't.

Understandable. Granted, what I usually see (from many industry folk) is, "You can't trust what anyone at WotC has to say... but you can trust me."

 

[JoeGKushner]

My statement was based on a general trend I've seen in posts in various threads on various fora. Granted, it was probably not appropriate for me to bring it up, but I guess I was curious.


Understandable. Granted, what I usually see (from many industry folk) is, "You can't trust what anyone at WotC has to say... but you can trust me."

Or Mongoose...

 

[BryonD]

As far as why eyebeams posts are negative (and, not coincidentally, why I haven't participated in this thread's main debate)....generally it's very frustrating to work in the industry and have people who don't (and who only know what corporate PR and personal anecdotal evidence tells them) insist that they know what's REALLY going on, and you don't.

hmmmm

That seems backward, at least for the past many pages. The main issue has been specific to claims from WotC and Mongoose. If eyebeams actually knows what is REALLY going on with those two companies, then he needs to come up with some evidence.

I think there are certain small time publishers that find it a lot easier to blame their problems on the industry as a whole than to look at their own products and business models. When someone else claims they are doing well, it can mess with that rationalization.

(Phil Reed and Chris Pramas have both posted here and they are certainly not included in that[neither the "small time" nor "blame" comments], as well as the vast majority of others)

 

[BryonD]

Understandable. Granted, what I usually see (from many industry folk) is, "You can't trust what anyone at WotC has to say... but you can trust me."

Exactly. You get this line of "You are an outsider, so no one should listen to you. Now, listen to me while I tell you all about WotC. What? Me work there? No. But it doesn't matter."

sigh :\

 

[philreed]

I think something that all publishers would agree on, from the smallest to the largest, is that the current distribution systems is not helping to solve the problem.

I wouldn't be surprised at all to learn that companies like WotC and White Wolf are doing better through mass market distribution than they are the hobby channels.

 

[GMSkarka]

Granted, what I usually see (from many industry folk) is, "You can't trust what anyone at WotC has to say... but you can trust me."

...and what many industry folk see is "I don't actually know how the business works, but I'm going to tell you that you're wrong anyway....or make insinuations that you're somehow trying to blame others for your failures."

Plus, given the fact that some gamers seem to take the health of the hobby as some kind of validation of their self-worth, wrapped up in issues of social ostracization during adolescence.....and you end up with a subject that you're better off just not debating them on.

EDIT: Upon reading this, I realize that it could be interpreted as a slap at some of the posters to this thread. That is not my intention. This was not aimed at anyone...only a reference to my experiences on this topic with many gamers, on many fora and at many conventions, over the past 10 years or so.

 

[Belen]

...and what many industry folk see is "I don't actually know how the business works, but I'm going to tell you that you're wrong anyway....or make insinuations that you're somehow trying to blame others for your failures."

Plus, given the fact that some gamers seem to take the health of the hobby as some kind of validation of their self-worth, wrapped up in issues of social ostracization during adolescence.....and you end up with a subject that you're better off just not debating them on.

Really, it always seems to me that they could not care less. The old "I have enough material to last me x" is always very annoying. There seems to be a lot of selfishness among gamers. It is more like "No one did anything for me, so why should I do anything for anyone else?"

This is not always the case, but it seems to be a strong theme.

 

[Kanegrundar]

Really, it always seems to me that they could not care less. The old "I have enough material to last me x" is always very annoying. There seems to be a lot of selfishness among gamers. It is more like "No one did anything for me, so why should I do anything for anyone else?"

This is not always the case, but it seems to be a strong theme.

(on/devil's advocate) Yet at the same time, if the RPG industry quit printing games, it wouldn't affect the world as a whole in the least. Even many (I daresay most) working in the industry are not doing so full time and therefore wouldn't be affected too negatively since they already have another job. I'm not trying to be a heartless prick, but whether or not the industry is doing well has no affect on my day to day life. I do have more than enough material to keep playing until I or the rest of my group falls dead. (off/devil's advocate)

In all seriousness, beyond knowing that my favorite writers will continue to have jobs tomorrow, the health of the RPG industry doesn't affect me. I'd like to think that it's going to keep going for as long as I am interested in playing, but it doesn't keep me up at night. I feel the same way about any entertainment industry.