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Defeating a Balor

Aloïsius said:
Legend Lore to know the True Name of the Balor.
Then, buy a 20 000 GP. Cast "trap the soul". No need to worry about things like SR if you know the name of the beast, and a nice +2 save DC.
Skip the gem. It's a Conjouration(Summoning) Sor/Wiz 8 spell. Shades is your friend. With a couple of feats and/or PrC levels, it does not matter if he makes the initial save, or not.

Of course, your DM may disagree, as the gem is an "active" component in the spell (has a listed role).
 

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pawsplay said:
I never said bonus. I said increase, and there are no limitations on increases.
But there are no rules on increases, stacking or otherwise. So, what rule do you have that says that two increases stack, unnamed or named? Not calling them bonuses does not mean you weren't using the rules on bonuses. :)
Hyp said:
What does the last sentence mean?
It means that they are cumulative, just like it says. You'll note that bane does not have that text, so is it cumulative? That's where you get into the discussion on 'normal'.
Hyp said:
To me, it seems that a +1 X-Bane Y-Bane sword, which has an enhancement bonus that is +2 better than normal and also +2 better than normal, has an enhancement bonus that is +4 better than normal.
Show me how/why you add the two +2's together. What allows you to do that? Clearly, you're making one or the other bane operative on a different 'normal' than the other. In other words: "To me, it seems that a +1 X-Bane Y-Bane sword, which has an enhancement bonus that is +2 better than +1 (normal) vs. X-Bane and +2 better than +3 (normal) vs. Y-Bane, has an enhancement bonus that is +4 better than +1 (normal)." If you use +1 in the Y-Bane clause, you can't get to +5.
 


Infiniti2000 said:
But there are no rules on increases, stacking or otherwise. So, what rule do you have that says that two increases stack, unnamed or named? Not calling them bonuses does not mean you weren't using the rules on bonuses. :)

Why do I need I rule that says they stack? In the absence of any other factors, two increases will both apply, unless the result would be a contradiction.

Let us suppose for a moment that increases do not "stack." (Now, that's meaningless, because increases don't stack, lie down or play dead, they just make something bigger, but let's suppose it for a moment). That's bad news for someone who wants to increase his Strength at 8th level if he already did so at 4th. It makes it very difficult to increase the size of advanced monsters. Further, advanced monsters that increased in size would not necessarily have access to Improved Natural Attack. No character could advance beyond 2nd level in a class. Practiced caster and the Good domain power would not combine their effects for the caster level of spells. A character's hit points would have only a limited ability to increase, and any class ability that said it increased every X levels would be cut short after one increase.

Now, I did not use the word "increase" because the ability uses it, but simply because the ability states the weapon is treated as "+2 better than its normal enhancement bonus." There is no indication that it is a typed bonus that does not stack, so it must therefore be:

a) not a bonus, or
b) an unnamed bonus

If it is not a bonus, there is nothing preventing the increase from applying twice. If it is, it is an unnamed bonus. The question is simply, does more than one bane effect count as a different effect? Ordinarily, a weapon may have only one bane effect (by my reading, since bane is a particular property and each weapon has one chosen foe). The ranged weapon/armoo situation complicates this. Two bane effects versus the same creature type would clearly not stack, but two bane effects that are intended for different foes seem to be a different source to me. As each one pertains to a specific foe, it is not the same as one that pertains to a different foe (bane is not cast and a foe chosen each time; each magic item contains only one specific bane property).
 

Death Throes countermeasure

I came up with this one when fighting homebrewed monsters that blow up when killed.

When attacking a balor, at least one PC should be doing nonlethal damage to it. This will increase the window between unconsiousness and death, greatly if the nonleathal damage is being done by a high damage dealer.

When it falls unconsious, loot it of its treasure, then kill it with ranged attacks 101' away.

File this one away in your tactics database. :)
 

frankthedm said:
Balors are large. A 5X5 wall might not be enough unless it is right in front of the target. And just how do you know who to put the force wall in front of unless you already are seeing them implode?

Spellcraft can be used to identify any magical effect that has a spell equivalent. Readied Actions have the peculiar property that they can complete before the observed trigger is finished.

If you are a high enough level Wizard to be fighting a Balor, your Spellcraft skill is probably +25 or better. Swami predicts you will make that skill check.

Furthermore, Implosion is also Close range, so the eligible targets may be few or one if the party spreads out.

You are correct that 5x5 would usually not be sufficient.
 

pawsplay, Hyp, we shall agree to disagree. If anyone wants to continue that discussion on banes stacking, I'd be happy to in another thread. My apologies to the OP for the derailment. :)
 

Assay Spell Resistance (+10 to overcome spell resistance) from Complete Arcane and Spell Compendium for wizards should nulify the SR problem. It's also a SWIFT spell.


My high level wizards use that a lot....
 


I have one, it was in 3.0, the fighter8/rogue12 with holy aura and fire resistance was grappled by the whip, dragged near the Balor, immolated, struck by the sword (not beheaded) and...the SR was pierced and the Balor missed the save versus the Holy aura, went blind, it was the rogue's turn, he wore two weapons with all those feats.
You know, when you're blind near a rogue with seven attacks it's never a good day.
 

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