D&D 5E Deities and 5th Edition

[ElectricDragon]

I recall earlier editions where great adventures were to be had involving the gods personally interacting with the players. Not novice characters, but seasoned adventurers after a long road to fame/infamy.
I see Tiamat and want more.
I want rules to make my own deities in 5e. Not just lists of domains and holy symbols and alignments; but actual personalities that will work with and in the campaign.
And yes, sometimes people just feel the need to take it to the next level and challenge a god. I as DM still want to be prepared for that.

The best rules I've seen are a combo of the epic rules and the deity rules from 3.xe (both full of holes and questionable abilities). But I would like to change my campaign to 5e from 3.5 and have lots of gods that no one else has that kind of set the theme of my campaign. Without such framework within which to build my brand of the "heavens and hells" that support and threaten the mortal world; I feel the atmosphere will be lacking a dimension that I feel is a part of campaign construction.

I have no problem playing in 5e, in fact I like it. But without rules for creating my own deities in 5e, I will not be running it.

 

[Arilyn]

Understand you wanting to have a richer system with the gods. But do you need rules to create your pantheon? Make them, however you see fit. Gods, after all, are not bound by mortal rules.

As far as domains are concerned, you could be more strict. Only clerics of Caedar, for example, can access the trickery domain. It is easy enough to add more flavour, by having players both receive boons from the gods they are allied with, and banes from the ones they have ticked off. Meeting deities who are wandering the mortal world is a fun staple of fantasy fiction, especially if players don't find out until later. Lots of room for your ideas, which could be placed easily in any game you choose.

 

[Arilyn]

5e deities and 5th edition

Looking again at your post, I see you are wanting concrete rules to build your heaven and hell. Couldn't the ones you are using be ported over, and changed to suit, especially since you expressed some dissatisfaction with them?

 

[cbwjm]

If you already have a system for creating gods in an earlier edition that you like using, then you could probably use most of that for 5e.

When creating a pantheon, the first thing I do in 5e is make a list of all of the available domains. You will want at least 1 god for each domain. After that, I start building the pantheon and filling in placeholder names next to each domain along with notes some extra notes (alignment, motivations, divine allies/enemies, etc). I won't be needing stat blocks so I don't worry about those but if I did, I'd look at the stats for Tiamat and build an avatar as close as possible to her power level.

I will often look at established pantheons for ideas such as Greek, Norse, Egyptian, Faerunian, Dragonlance, or the gods from Magic the Gathering's Theros block. Even their planeswalkers can be used as a basis for gods.

Normally I won't go into much, if any, details for a god's realm. If I need a realm then I will just look up an outer plane that matches the gods alignment and situate it there or come up with a name for the home realm of all of the gods. It could be named something as simple as the Overworld, a divine reflection of the prime plane of existence.

 

[Ilbranteloth]

I recall earlier editions where great adventures were to be had involving the gods personally interacting with the players. Not novice characters, but seasoned adventurers after a long road to fame/infamy.
I see Tiamat and want more.
I want rules to make my own deities in 5e. Not just lists of domains and holy symbols and alignments; but actual personalities that will work with and in the campaign.
And yes, sometimes people just feel the need to take it to the next level and challenge a god. I as DM still want to be prepared for that.

The best rules I've seen are a combo of the epic rules and the deity rules from 3.xe (both full of holes and questionable abilities). But I would like to change my campaign to 5e from 3.5 and have lots of gods that no one else has that kind of set the theme of my campaign. Without such framework within which to build my brand of the "heavens and hells" that support and threaten the mortal world; I feel the atmosphere will be lacking a dimension that I feel is a part of campaign construction.

I have no problem playing in 5e, in fact I like it. But without rules for creating my own deities in 5e, I will not be running it.

Outside of the Immortals rules for D&D (the 'I' in BECMI), I don't really recall any products that specifically covered making your own deities. Some Dragon articles from back in the day, but I'm probably forgetting something.

As for adventures involving the gods, or the characters challenging them, I'm guessing that was part of the epic rules in 3.5e?

I guess I'll need a reminder of what products from earlier editions that provide examples of what you're looking for.

Regardless, I think that approach is pretty far down the list of what WotC is planning simply because they've capped levels at 20th. Yes, they have the boon system, but that's probably insufficient to create characters that can fight the gods. That doesn't mean there won't be such a product, but I'm guessing it's more likely to be something that somebody else develops, either for DMsGuild, or a published product.

 

[ElectricDragon]

Deities and Demigods 3.0 and Epic Level Handbook 3.0; There are conversions for 3.5. But is 3.5 similar enough to port them over without overhaul?
Deities and Demigods had complete rules for creating your own deity, listing domains, salient divine abilities, portfolios, etc. as well as generic deific abilities available to all gods of a certain rank.

I have no trouble making up the gods, I have them done and integral to the campaign. I just wondered if anyone had thought about doing a deity book for 5e (not campaign specific) with rules for making your own gods. Or is it up to me? It is a big job that would take a while, but if there is one in the works already, I can wait. It seems though that this aspect of the game is not being updated, improved, or converted. Am I alone in wanting more than a name for a god?

 

[Ilbranteloth]

Deities and Demigods 3.0 and Epic Level Handbook 3.0; There are conversions for 3.5. But is 3.5 similar enough to port them over without overhaul?
Deities and Demigods had complete rules for creating your own deity, listing domains, salient divine abilities, portfolios, etc. as well as generic deific abilities available to all gods of a certain rank.

I have no trouble making up the gods, I have them done and integral to the campaign. I just wondered if anyone had thought about doing a deity book for 5e (not campaign specific) with rules for making your own gods. Or is it up to me? It is a big job that would take a while, but if there is one in the works already, I can wait. It seems though that this aspect of the game is not being updated, improved, or converted. Am I alone in wanting more than a name for a god?

I haven't seen anybody comment on one. Being that it's a "generic" book, that seems like it would be a good one to convert to 5e for DMsGuild. I haven't checked that out in a long time, didn't really hold any interest in my for my game. As I said, I would be very surprised if WotC was working on it, but there are already several on DMsGuild. Just do a search for "epic." I don't think they cover deities specifically, but they are probably a good starting point.

Checking out the 3e ELH, I had forgotten that they didn't really give much in the way of combat bonuses and such after level 20. That's good, because it makes it easier to work into 5e. A quick look through it and I think it would work fairly well. I'd suggest starting with looking at the guidelines for creating monsters in the DMG and comparing it to designing epic level creatures in the ELH. That should give you a starting point to see how the math differs.

I might go so far as to take 20th level 5e characters with a couple of boons each and testing it against a 3/3.5e epic adventure that you've run before. See how well it works (or doesn't).

The challenge that I think you're going to run into is what has sparked a lot of threads already - high level monsters are tough to do well in 5e, primarily due to action economy. It's a bit of a double-edged sword - you can provide legendary actions to a deity (or their avatar) to give them more attacks or actions per round, and it also spreads them out throughout the round, instead of just on their turn. That helps a lot to make a solo creature more of a challenge. But it also needs to be able to last a few rounds to be a real threat. But the action economy can also work against you, because it also limits what the PCs can do. A round of bad rolls can be deadly.

I would also probably consider giving all deities bonus actions for use in combat, and to differentiate them even further, a selection of potential reactions that they can use.

Of course, the boons in the DMG are a great place to start, and most deities should probably have some of these at least.

 

[Ancalagon]

A post I made a few days ago is rather fitting here

(some context: this is a Yoon-Suin game)

"One of the features of the campaign I'm running is that there are hundreds of deities.

It's... oddly liberating. None of them have to make sense, it's impossible to detail them all so no one expects me to, and I can create a cult on the spot with no concerns about any "why haven't we heard of them before?!?" questions from the PCs."

When we started the campaign, I asked the player (who wanted to play a cleric) what domain she was most interested in. She said knowledge. So I created half a dozen knowledge related gods, she picked one and we went on from there.

- Phtol, the lady of the dawn. Crane-aspected. Holy colors are pink and yellow. Morning and dreams. Sacrifice of eels. Intense dislike of the crane of hunger (Followers of Parkij are merely contemptuous), shrine facing each other across an arm of the river. Domains granted are light or knowledge (dreams bring insight). Given prayers by those who hope to wake up with insight or inspiration.

- Odi Kolodi, the lord of books. Royal blue and black are this cult's sacred colors. He demands sacrifices of fruit. Is represented as a small monkey. Grants the domain of knowledge. Especially concerned about the preservation of knowledge in the form of books. Looks favorably on scribes, scholars etc.

- Tali Pa, mistress of the library. Followers dress in grey. Is said to be a snake and demands eggs of all kind as sacrifice. Grants the domain of knowledge. Concerned by the preservation and *organization* of knowledge.

- Yato, hoarder of secrets. A mole. Wine red is his sacred color. He demands the sacrifice of *hands* (any hands will do, not just yours!). Grants the domain of knowledge or trickery. Prayed to by those looking to discover secrets and keep them for themselves.

- The Cosmic Snail, the God that Get there in the end. Yellowish green is the holy color. Followers are obsessed with endings, especially of things that have been going on for some time (such as the world). Demands sacrifice of sweets. Grants the domains of death or knowledge. (original idea from http://thehauntedgasworks.tumblr.com/image/115759159028 ).

The Memory Tree: This ancient pippala tree's leaves constantly move, even when there is no wind. It's fruit is said to fortify the memory, allowing one to remember long forgotten facts, but also retain new knowledge. Demands sacrifice of blood, which is poured directly onto the roots. The holy men tending to the tree dress in pure white. Grants the domains of Knowledge.

She chose the Memory Tree

 

[77IM]

Most RPGs don't have rules for deities. What exactly would you want such rules to do?

 

[Arilyn]

You have already created your pantheon, and fit them into the world. That sounds like the hard part.It shouldn't be too difficult to stat out the gods. If your players are starting at low level, and working up to epic, you have lots of time to get a feel for the game, and the capabilities of the characters. I wouldn't even bother working out all the nitty gritty of the deities abilities until players are capable of dealing with them. By the time characters are really high level, you'll know best way to challenge them.