Demi-Classless System

[seasong]

This is a small bit of the house rules I've put together for my Europ campaign. I am soliciting commentary, critiques, and any problems you can see with this. I know it won't please everyone (for example, anyone who wants to retain archetypal characters), but I would like it to be as good as possible for what it does.

Class & Level

Class Construction System

Each level you gain a number of class points which you can spend on various class features. The "typical" campaign will start with 45 points at 1st level, and gain 18 points per level thereafter. Europ starts with 30 points at 1st level, and gains 12 points per level thereafter.

BAB: 3 points per +1 BAB (BAB can not exceed level).
Hit Points: 2 points per +1 hp.
- you start with CON x2 hit points, times a size multiplier (x2 for Large, x1/2 for Small).
Basic AC: 3 points per +1 BAC (BAC can not exceed level).
Saves: 1 point per +1 to a save (base saves can not exceed level +1 without buying a feat)
Skills: 1 point per +1 skill point (skill points in one skill can not exceed level +3).
Feats: 5 points per feat.

Note: The Toughness feat is not allowed. A feat can provide a +2 to a save or skill, above and beyond the normal level-based limit, but you may only take one such feat per save/skill per level.

Restrictions
Barred Alignment Axis: +1 points
Required Partial Neutral: +1 points
Two Barred Alignment Axes: +2 points
Required Alignment Axis: +2 points
Two Required Alignment Axes: +3 points
Paladin's Code: +3 points
Druidic Armor Restriction: +3 points

If you break a restriction, you lose twice its value in class abilities, usually from your feat selection. You can usually "repent & recover" your abilities, but this should be more difficult than simply following the restriction again.

Restrictions can not be "bought off" except by losing the aforementioned class abilities.

Class Feats

BARBARIAN FEATS
Fast Movement (1 feat: +10' per round movement)
Rage (1 feat: use 1/day)
Greater Rage (1 feat: increases Rage to +6)
Not Winded By Rage (1 feat: as it says)
Uncanny Dodge (1 feat: doesn't lose AC when flat-footed)
Uncanny Dodge (1 feat: can't be flanked)
Uncanny Dodge (1 feat: +2 vs traps, stackable)
Damage Reduction (1 feat: DR 1/-, stackable)

BARD FEATS
Bardic Music: Inspire Courage (1 feat)
Bardic Music: Countersong (1 feat)
Bardic Music: Fascinate (1 feat)
Bardic Music: Inspire Competence (1 feat)
Bardic Music: Suggestion (1 feat)
Bardic Music: Inspire Greatness (1 feat)
Bardic Knowledge (1 feat)

CLERIC FEATS
Turn or Rebuke Undead (1 feat)
Domain-Related Abilities Vary (???)

DRUID FEATS
Nature Sense (1 feat)
Animal Companion (1 feat)
Woodland Stride (1 feat)
Trackless Step (1 feat)
Resist Nature's Lure (1 feat)
Wild Shape (1 feat: use 1/day)
Wild Shape: Large (1 feat, modifies Wild Shape)
Wild Shape: Huge (1 feat, modifies Wild Shape)
Wild Shape: Tiny (1 feat, modifies Wild Shape)
Wild Shape: Dire (1 feat, modifies Wild Shape)
Wild Shape: Elemental (1 feat, modifies Wild Shape, takes 2 uses!)
Venom Immunity (1 feat)
A Thousand Faces (1 feat)
Timeless Body (1 feat)

FIGHTER FEATS
11 feats spread over the levels

MONK FEATS
Improved Unarmed Strike (1 feat, 1d6 damage, no AoO)
Unarmed Damage (1 feat: stages damage up: d8, d10, d12, d20)
Flurry of Blows (1 feat)
Rapid Movement (1 feat per +10' per round movement)
AC Bonus (buy as BAC)
Stunning Attack (1 feat)
Evasion (1 feat)
Improved Evasion (1 feat)
Deflect Arrows (1 feat)
Still Mind (1 feat)
Slow Fall (1 feat: stages distance up: 20', 40', 60', any distance)
Purity of Body (1 feat)
Improved Trip (1 feat)
Wholeness of Body (1 feat)
Leap of the Clouds (1 feat)
Ki Strike (1 feat: treat unarmed as +1 weapon, stackable)
Diamond Body (1 feat)
Abundant Step (1 feat)
Diamond Soul (1 feat)
Quivering Palm (1 feat)
Timeless Body (1 feat)
Tongue of the Sun & Moon (1 feat)
Empty Body (1 feat)
Perfect Self (1 feat)

PALADIN FEATS
Detect Evil (1 feat)
Divine Grace (1 feat)
Lay On Hands (1 feat)
Divine Health (1 feat)
Aura of Courage (1 feat)
Smite Evil (1 feat)
Remove Disease (1 feat)
Turn Undead (1 feat)
Special Mount (1 feat)
Remove Disease 6/week (4 steps)

RANGER FEATS
Track (1 feat)
Favored Enemies (1 feat: 1 enemy)
Ambidexterity (1 feat)
Two-Weapon Fighting (1 feat)

ROGUE FEATS
Sneak Attack (1 feat: +1d6 flanking damage, stackable)
Evasion (1 feat)
Uncanny Dodge (1 feat: doesn't lose AC when flat-footed)
Uncanny Dodge (1 feat: can't be flanked)
Uncanny Dodge (1 feat: +2 vs traps, stackable)
Crippling Strike (1 feat)
Defensive Roll (1 feat)
Improved Evasion (1 feat)
Opportunist (1 feat)
Skill Mastery (1 feat)
Slippery Mind (1 feat)

SORCEROR FEATS
Summon Familiar (1 feat)

WIZARD FEATS
Summon Familiar (1 feat)
Scribe Scroll (1 feat)
4 Bonus Metamagic Feats

FOR ALL SPELL CASTERS
Each spell level you are able to cast is a feat. Thus, the ability to cast level 0 Arcane spells is a feat; level 1 spells is a second feat; and so on.

For spells per day, use the chart for your caster type, using the lower of your character level and your highest level spell feat. For spells known, use the higher of these two (thus, a 5th level character with the spell feat '5th level spells' would know the spells, but be unable to cast them).

For arcane magic, choose wizard or sorcerer from the start, and you will always follow this progression.

Alternately, you may wish to use my Europ magic rules.

Skill Rules

Class Skills

PCs choose 12 skills which they learn as Class Skills. Everything else is double cost to learn. This list remains the same throughout the PC's career, although a feat may be taken to learn a new Class Skill; each feat allows the PC to learn one additional skill as a Class Skill.

Skill lists should reflect background, training and natural inclinations.

Arms & Armor Proficiency

Weapon and armor use now uses skill points rather than feats. Each weapon (including unarmed strikes and grappling) or armor type (light, medium, heavy and shields) costs 1 skill point to learn. Characters have NO proficiencies by default, unless they put skill into it.

Additional skill points may be put into a particular weapon proficiency. Each 1 point gives one "feat" with that weapon only. You must meet all of the normal prerequisites for the feat (to Deflect Arrows, you must have DEX 13+). You can still take the feat normally (in which case it applies to all weapons that it would normally apply to). The feats that may be taken in this manner are:

Ambidexterity
Cleave
Combat Reflexes
Deflect Arrows (improved unarmed strike or weapon focus)
Expertise
Far Shot
Improved Bull Rush (shield)
Improved Critical
Improved Disarm
Improved Trip (wrestling)
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting (must take for each weapon able to use)
Improved Unarmed Strike (unarmed strike)
Point Blank Shot
Power Attack
Precise Shot
Quick Draw
Rapid Shot
Ride-By Attack
Shot on the Run
Spirited Charge
Spring Attack
Stunning Fist (unarmed strike)
Sunder
Two-Weapon Fighting (must take for each weapon able to use)
Weapon Finesse
Weapon Focus
Weapon Specialization

If you are in doubt as to whether or not a weapon feat should be available for a skill point, apply the following litmus test:

1. Is the feat "extraordinary"? (for example, Whirlwind attack). If yes, it should not be available for a skill point.

2. Does the feat represent skill with the weapon, or skill at something else while using the weapon? (for example, Mounted Combat is skill with the mount while using a weapon). If skill at something else, it should not be available for a skill point.

Literacy

Characters are illiterate by default. It costs 1 skill point to be literate in a particular script.

Combat Modifications

Hit Points

Characters start at 1st level with hit points equal to CON x2. Small characters halve this, and Large characters double it (each size category thereafter also halves or doubles hit points). Monster hit points are calculated in exactly the same way.

You can improve your hit points with class points, but this is costly (2 points per +1 hit point).

Armor Class & Damage Resistance

Armor provides you with DR equal to its AC. Thus, armor with AC +3 becomes armor with DR 3/-. Shields still provide an AC bonus.

Magical armors add the bonus to DR.
Magical shields add the bonus to AC.

AC will normally equal:
10 + Size Bonus + BAC + DEX Bonus

Size Bonus
Small +3
Medium +0
Large -3

 

[Jeph]

Very nice. Here's a little suggestion based off of the "hits defeated" experience mechanic used in YBA.

Instead of getting XP, characters get Points Defeated. Every time a character defeats an opponent, they gain a number of Points Defeated equal to the number of Points that their enemy had. If the character does well but does not defeat their opponent, maybe give them a thid or fourth of this number.

When a character has massed Points Defeated equal to the points that make up their character +1, they gain 1 additional point for the character, and then subtract their new number of points from their Points Defeated.

Characters may save up points in a "point bank." For example, Joe Schmoe wants to get +1 BAB, and has 50 character points. When he has defeated 51 CP, he puts a point in his point bank. He does the same when he defeats another 52 CP. When he defeats another 53 CP, he uses the new point, plus the 2 in his point bank, to buy +1 BAB.

If multiple characters defeat the enemy, divide the points between the participants. GMs should require a day or three of training before the new point comes into effect.

EXAMPLE: Johnny is a 80 CP character. he single-handedly defeats a 40 CP Fish, bringing him up to 40 Points Defeated. Then, with his frend Joe, he defeats a 50 CP Dire Fish, bringing him up to 65 Points Defeated. The next weak, with his pals Joe and Jim, they defeat a 60 CP Legendary Dire Fish. This brings Johnny up to 85 Points Defeated. He gains +1 CP and his Points Defeated total resets to 4.

 

[Infinite Monkey@Work]

Sounds very nice. Some comments:

You need to add prerequisites for most of the class feats. Wildshape:large requires wildshape etc.

You should try to divorce the hitpoint/armour rules from the classless rules. I.e. there should be the rules as written, and the rules altered to allow for close to standard hitpoint progressions and combat.

My knee-jerk rule would be that you roll 1d4+Con bonus for hitpoints each level. The die rolled can be upgraded by one step per point spent, so rolling 1d10+Con bonus costs 3 points (d4->d6->d8->d10). Points need to be respent each level, so getting a fighters hitpoints costs 3 points each and every level.

A few things could do with being better explained, but nothing is too difficult to figure out.

Some things need to be explicitly stated (like you get Int bonus points per level that can only be spent on skills).

Otherwise this is really excellent, and if I was starting a new campaign anytime soon I would very seriously consider using it.

 

[Infinite Monkey@Work]

Another idea:

Instead of restrictions giving bonus points, they could give discounts to 'related' feats, which are then lost if you break the restriction. Discount of about half whats given as bonus points (round the discount down)

E.g. Paladins code gives a 1 1/2 point discount, causing any feats 'linked' to it to cost 4 points. Paladins code plus Lawful Good only gives a total discount of 3 points, causing feats to cost 2 points each.

But then, any feat bought using the discount is lost if the restriction is broken. So if a paladin bought divine grace at full cost (5 points) he doesn't lose it if he changes alignment, but if he payed the discounted price (2 points) he would.

EDIT : On second thought, thats probably WAY to powerful.

 

[Jeph]

Looking over, it seems blaringly obvious that all the class abilities are better then feats. Have them cost between 6 and 8 cp.

 

[seasong]

You need to add prerequisites for most of the class feats. Wildshape:large requires wildshape etc.

Yes. I'll try to work that in. Thanks!

You should try to divorce the hitpoint/armour rules from the classless rules. I.e. there should be the rules as written, and the rules altered to allow for close to standard hitpoint progressions and combat.

My knee-jerk rule would be that you roll 1d4+Con bonus for hitpoints each level. The die rolled can be upgraded by one step per point spent, so rolling 1d10+Con bonus costs 3 points (d4->d6->d8->d10). Points need to be respent each level, so getting a fighters hitpoints costs 3 points each and every level.

My original intent: 0 hp per level, 1 point buys you +2 hp, if you are using the default D20 hit point system.

This works out about the same cost & hit points as what you suggested, so either one would work for me.

A few things could do with being better explained, but nothing is too difficult to figure out.

All of it could probably be better explained. Anything in particular catch your eye?

Some things need to be explicitly stated (like you get Int bonus points per level that can only be spent on skills).

True.

Otherwise this is really excellent, and if I was starting a new campaign anytime soon I would very seriously consider using it.

Thank you! Let me know if there is anything you'd want in the system, specifically, and I'll see if I can't write up the option.

 

[seasong]

Another idea:

Instead of restrictions giving bonus points, they could give discounts to 'related' feats, which are then lost if you break the restriction. Discount of about half whats given as bonus points (round the discount down)

I would have to make the point break extremely low in order to make that workable. Because I'd get alignment restrictions tied to everything.

As it is, it works just like what you described, except that it only reduces the cost of one ability.

 

[seasong]

Looking over, it seems blaringly obvious that all the class abilities are better then feats. Have them cost between 6 and 8 cp.

You are probably right. At least some of the class abilities take multiple feats already (rage is 1 feat per daily use), while others probably need some bumping up (some of the monk immunities, for example). But estimating the cost is difficult without playtesting - as beta rules, if something turned out to be hideously useful, I'd just charge 1-3 extra points to the character at a higher level to rebalance things.