Describe Pinning Smash to me

[Nebulous]

I don't mind that the power keeps a big baddie pinned down, it's a daily, but i have a hard time envisioning exactly how this power works. Sure, you anchor an ogre through the foor and it can't move, or maybe you hamstring it, but isn't the power tied to your weapon? If you pull the blade out, what is pinning the monster down? If you attack someone else, what is pinning the monster down? What if you attack a ghost or a water elemental, how do you pin it down besides "The power says so"?

I just want a way to explain in-game how this power works consistently with niche cases because i'm having a hard time doing it. thanks.

nebulous

 

[Plane Sailing]

I wish I could help you, but I've got no idea!

As a DM I personally have changed all the 'immobilise with a weapon' attacks to be 'recharge when target no longer immobilised, can't use weapon while immobilising target' or something similar. This gives a degree of consistency between monsters so that people can draw upon their experience to suss out how it might work.

The niche cases you talk about here though... we would probably all shrug our shoulders, laugh, make some disparaging comments and then move on

 

[Nebulous]

Curses! Well, then i might adopt your rule and make it easy to "end" the immobilization, but it recharges immediately as well. That shouldn't PO the players too much. But the first time they try to pin down a Ghost...sheesh.

 

[Lizard]

Well, it's "Immobilized until you're not adjacent to it".

So you hit it hard enough that it can't move. Since you don't lose your weapon, assume you kneecap it, or, for ghosts and water elementals, disrupt it enough that it can't manage to move. If it tries to stagger away, you whack it again (this is not an actual rolled attack, but a description of how the power "works") Only if it is pulled away, or you leave, can it manage to get its feet (or pseudopods) working again.

Generally, while it's a lot more realistic to impose limits on what martial powers can do, doing so screws over the martial classes, as wizards, swordmages, barbarians, etc, can use their powers to affect ghosts and elementals freely. You basically end up reducing the martial power source to second class status. It would be akin to saying some kinds of hit point damage can only be cured by clerics, not bards or warlords.

 

[ChristopherA]

Pinning Smash is just a logical extension of the normal fighter abilities. The whole gimmick of the 4th edition fighter is that he attacks with such fierceness and skill that the opponent is virtually immobilized, he can't even shift without granting the fighter a free attack. Pinning Smash just means the fighter dramatically ups his game to the point where the poor monster can't even try to move.

Actually, if is even easier to understand if you mentally reword the power as, "any attempt by the target to move triggers a free opportunity attack by the fighter that automatically hits for no damage". This gets rid of any mysticism; it is just superhuman skill from the fighter to make these attacks, and Combat Superiority that prevents the target from moving.



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[Nebulous]

Pinning Smash is just a logical extension of the normal fighter abilities. The whole gimmick of the 4th edition fighter is that he attacks with such fierceness and skill that the opponent is virtually immobilized, he can't even shift without granting the fighter a free attack. Pinning Smash just means the fighter dramatically ups his game to the point where the poor monster can't even try to move.

Actually, if is even easier to understand if you mentally reword the power as, "any attempt by the target to move triggers a free opportunity attack by the fighter that automatically hits for no damage". This gets rid of any mysticism; it is just superhuman skill from the fighter to make these attacks, and Combat Superiority that prevents the target from moving.

Ok, that's kind of what i needed, just some sort of description of what is happening that makes a little sense. So even the ferocity of the attack is enough to quell a ghost. fine, it's fantasy i can live with that. It's just hard to see in my mind's eye when the scene is playing out, but this helps.



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[Plane Sailing]

Thanks ChristopherA, I find that helpful too. In a way the name 'Pinning Smash' is a red herring. Best for me to think of it as 'the power which hems the target in so that it can't move away by itself'.

Cheers

 

[Nebulous]

Thanks ChristopherA, I find that helpful too. In a way the name 'Pinning Smash' is a red herring. Best for me to think of it as 'the power which hems the target in so that it can't move away by itself'.

Cheers

"Hemming Smash" works better for me

 

[BobTheNob]

Last play session we had the party up against a blue dragon. Our cleric used command and shifted the dragon (who was circling the party pounding them with ranged) to a position between our fighter and rogue. Fighter used pinning smash the lock the dragon down and went defensive (with parry gauntlets...a total of +4 to all defenses).

Now the rest of the fight will be fighter goes defensive while rogue tears dragon new arse.

Pinning smash = devestating (if your players know what they are doing)

 

[ChristopherA]

Thanks ChristopherA, I find that helpful too. In a way the name 'Pinning Smash' is a red herring. Best for me to think of it as 'the power which hems the target in so that it can't move away by itself'.

Cheers

Glad to be of service. I think it is that descriptive text which is really deceptive. If I only read that, I would have thought the power knocked the opponent prone or grabbed him. The name "Pinning Strike" makes sense if you think of using the non-wrestling sense of "pin", as in when a military unit is pinned down by hostile fire.



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