Detect magic + Spellcraft = aggravation?

[Quasqueton]

Whereas some folks [not I] say detect evil makes certain plots difficult to run, I’m finding that detect magic makes many adventure effects difficult to run. At least with detect evil, the “gazer” can’t determine what the evil is (beyond basic strength, which is not usually very helpful, unless the aura is “Strong” or “Overwhelming” and the PCs are not). But with detect magic and a Spellcraft check, the gazer can determine the school and maybe even the specific spell in effect. This has made my work as DM sometimes fairly complicated.

Have you had any headaches with detect magic and Spellcraft? How do you deal with it?

Quasqueton

 

[buzz]

No headaches to report. As a DM, you need to just keep in mind that PCs have access to this ability.

 

[frankthedm]

Or simply return the spell to only being able to determine magic or not magic.

 

[Voadam]

I've never seen an interpretation that it tells you the specific spell.

An ID'd school is fun info to try to work with IME.

 

[helium3]

Could you please elaborate on why PC's knowing the school of magic of a particular aura is causing headaches for you?

 

[Joshua Randall]

Uh, detect evil does give you location:

3rd Round: The power and location of each aura. If an aura is outside your line of sight, then you discern its direction but not its exact location.

But anyway, I, too, am curious how detect magic is ruining your game.

 

[Umbran]

But with detect magic and a Spellcraft check, the gazer can determine the school and maybe even the specific spell in effect.

Detect Magic, as written, does not tell the caster the specific spell that is in effect, even with Spellcraft checks. They'd have to puzzle specifics out from the school, and whatever other information is available from other senses.

And that's okay. It is traditional to have challenges that can be puzzled around like that. If they can figure it out and use that information, that's cool by me.

 

[ThirdWizard]

But... but... you can ID a spell without detect magic. See a glyph on the wall? Spellcraft check and you've got everything about it. And, I've never had a problem with it. I've never really had anything hinge on the PCs not being able to identify a spell. More often, I hinge things on the PCs knowing what spells things are. I do have a wizard in my 11th level game with a +26 to Spellcraft. Taking 10 is a 36. Not too shabby.

 

[Quasqueton]

But anyway, I, too, am curious how detect magic is ruining your game.

I never said it was ruining my game. It's not.

I've never seen an interpretation that it tells you the specific spell.

Detect Magic, as written, does not tell the caster the specific spell that is in effect, even with Spellcraft checks. They'd have to puzzle specifics out from the school, and whatever other information is available from other senses.

Spellcraft
20 + spell level
Identify a spell that’s already in place and in effect. You must be able to see or detect the effects of the spell. No action required. No retry.

With detect magic, you can see and detect, no?

Could you please elaborate on why PC's knowing the school of magic of a particular aura is causing headaches for you?

It's not really the PCs knowing the school of magic, but rather how detect magic, as now a ubiquitous 0-level spell, is used so often. And it's not really detect magic by itself, but in conjunction with Spellcraft.

<children need me . . . more later (maybe tomorrow)>

Quasqueton

 

[Agent Oracle]

Detect magic: is for lingering effects (i.e. THere is a enchantment placed on this shield / sword / hallway)

Spellcraft is for immediacy: "I see a kobold, he's raising his hands and mumbling" (roll, check, consult) "He's casting "web" I have been holding action, so i counterspell him."