Dice caps on spells

[Quasqueton]

What is the game mechanic purpose for dice caps on spells? Why does a fireball stop at 10d6? Why does magic missle stop at 5 missles? Etc.

Quasqueton

 

[dcollins]

The basic theory, I believe, is that spells that scale indefinitely risk being better choices (for high-level casters) than any higher-level spells. The designers want to avoid high-level wizards being incented from slotting a single 1st- or 3rd-level spell into all their spell slots up to 9th. That would be both pretty un-flavorful and a sign that the spell levels are broken.

As much as I loved it, here's some spells from 1st Edition that threatened to do that:
- Magic missile. (At 20th level, 10 missiles for auto 10d4+10, avg 35. I guess one could still put a cap on that today)
- Fireball. (Lots of 20th level casters asked about filling all 27 slots from 3-9 with 20d6 fireballs. Would definitely be better than meteor swarm at 30th level.)
- Chromatic Orb. (From Unearthed Arcana Illusionst spells. At 1st level, it's just a light spell. But at 12th level it's a death spell! Not a bad choice for a 20th level illusionist to take nothing but 30 of these 1st-level death spells in all their slots.)

 

[Ourph]

It should be noted, however, that the 1st ed. RAW didn't allow casters to place lower level spells in higher level slots, thus eliminating that whole problem.

 

[Piratecat]

I'm not so sure about that, Ourph. We did so at the time, and I don't believe we were using house rules.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Actually, PC, I think you might have been.

Regardless, it's still not exactly consonant with game balance to have lower-level spells that have better effects than higher-level ones; it means that higher-level spells come off comparatively weaker and that high-level casters get a compounding of offensive capability, which is something they really don't need. As an example, 1e wizards IMC used to throw magic missiles in preference to almost any other offensive spell; 10d4+10 unresistable damage was better than fireball to a single target, and even competitive with meteor swarm.

 

[Ourph]

I'm not so sure about that, Ourph. We did so at the time, and I don't believe we were using house rules.

The OAD&D rules don't specifically disallow it, nor do they specifically allow it. I can't recall off the top of my head if this issue was addressed in OD&D, 2e or the Mentzer D&D sets (I'm positive it's not addressed in B/X D&D either). If it was, it wouldn't surprise me if our collective unconscious had translated it into an official 1e rule (I certainly thought it was officially accepted for quite some time). However, the issue came up in one of my games last year and a thorough search of the PHB, DMG and UA yielded no specific rule addressing this option.

 

[Alan Shutko]

I can't recall off the top of my head if this issue was addressed in OD&D, 2e or the Mentzer D&D sets (I'm positive it's not addressed in B/X D&D either).

Rules Cyclopedia has a rule specifically limiting max damage on a spell to 20 dice. (That doesn't affect cures, which aren't caster-level dependent in RCD&D.)

A quick check shows that this was indeed introduced in the Companion set.

 

[Staffan]

Rules Cyclopedia has a rule specifically limiting max damage on a spell to 20 dice. (That doesn't affect cures, which aren't caster-level dependent in RCD&D.)

A quick check shows that this was indeed introduced in the Companion set.

Well, given that the Companion set covered levels 15-25, it wouldn't have been needed before that.

 

[shilsen]

What is the game mechanic purpose for dice caps on spells? Why does a fireball stop at 10d6? Why does magic missle stop at 5 missles? Etc.

Quasqueton

Balance.

 

[UltimaGabe]

Balance.

Exactly. Why take Meteor Swarm if Fireball does just as much damage, and only takes up a 3rd-level slot? Heck, if there weren't damage caps, you could Empower and Quicken a Fireball for the same level slot as a Meteor Swarm, and do a heck of a lot more damage. Why take Meteor Swarm? Why even bother leveling up at all, and not just buying items that up your caster level?

The way it is, spells will be powerful, but higher level spells will always be more powerful than lower level ones. It keeps things balanced and leaves an incentive to get higher-level spells.

And with things without extra dice per caster level, it's the same effect. If there wasn't a cap, two Cure Light spells will be far superior to a Cure Moderate, especially if you're a 20th-level caster. Why spend a 2nd-level slot for 28 points of healing on average if you can spend a 1st-level slot for 24 points?