Did This Prove to be True?

[Maggan]

This is my experience as well.

So the links I supplied that shows that TSR put out a lot more stuff than WotC has done, means nothing to you? :\

/M

 

[Voadam]

496 2e TSR books available as pdfs http://paizo.com/store/downloads/wizardsOfTheCoast

 

[Dykstrav]

Aw, gods. How do you use even a small fraction of that? I'm having a hard time lugging around the relevant 3E books as it is, and I basically only use the Complete series...

Well... I don't. I actually end up using about 5-8 different sourcebooks beyond the core rules per campaign. I'll never be able to use that much stuff, especially not in a single campaign.

Thing is, when I was in college, I used to work at a pizza place that just happened to be right next door to a game store. A free pizza or two got me a D&D book. Yay for bartering. If it wasn't for that arrangement, I would've probably bought maybe 20-30 of the D&D hardcovers that have been published. My point is, I have TONS of stuff that I've never even used in a game, so any reason I'd look at 4E would have nothing to do with the amount of source material available for it.

I noticed the links, Maggan, and I appreciate it. I've never been able to see complete lists of what was published under what edition before 3E.

 

[Voadam]

The number of books one really needs to buy is 3 in 1e/2e/3e.

As far as optional books are concerned, the 3e supplements are reasonably modular. You could buy 1 or 3 or 0 easily enough.

I found the 2e Options books to be pretty hopeless unless you bought a whole big bunch and integrated them as a de facto AD&D 2.5e done in full bloat mode.

Eh, I got a limited numbers and it went fine.

Complete Fighter had weapon specializations and weapon groups anybody could use. Fighters just had more weapon proficiencies to spend on them.

Complete Wizard had a bunch of neat new spells similar to many different supplements.

Complete Psionics added a new class and wild talents.

My friend's Complete Priest had a bunch of underpowered priest classes.

 

[RFisher]

See, the thing is that WotC gets paid when people buy books. If they don't release books, people won't buy books. WotC learned what T$R learned. If you publish it, they will come.

I thus I go into broken record mode again: D&D has never been Wizards primary product, & I predict it never will be. Wizards does not need to release a D&D book every month to get paid. They do have other products.

 

[Abisashi]

But it sounds like the break between 3 and 4 will be much harder to convert.

My understanding of what was said is that 4e is closer to 3e than 3e is to 2e, but they realized that conversion guides just don't work, so they aren't making one.

 

[Maggan]

WotC learned what T$R learned. If you publish it, they will come.

Or am I being overly cynical?

Yes.

TSR learned that "if you publish it and people don't buy it you go bankrupt and some upstart collectible card manufacturer buys you".

/M

 

[DaveMage]

WotC put out much less material for 3E than TSR did for 2E. However, when you factor in the d20/OGL publishers, especially in the 3.0 era before publishers started branching off into their own systems, much more material was released in total for 3E than for 2E. So I guess it depends on your perspective.

Yeah, this is the issue.

When you factor in d20/OGL companies, the amount of available D&D-compatible product for 3.x numbers in the 1000s. TSR couldn't hold a candle to it.

Option bloat happened because of this.

I think the 3.x years will go down as the renaissance of gaming, and, in fact, may be the best it will ever get as more and more people leave the tabletop behind for online pursuits or simply other entertainment options. 4E will be WotC and a maybe few other companies doing adventures.

I mean, what print publishers are going to support the latest edition of D&D?

(Maybe)
Paizo?
Necromancer Games?
Goodman Games?
Expeditious Retreat?
Paradigm?

I could see Green Ronin doing a 4e Freeport supplement, but beyond that they seem to have successfully moved away from a D&D base.

Mongoose has successfully moved on, and while they may use the new rules for their OGL products, I can't see them supporting D&D again in any large way.

White Wolf (whatever form they are now) also seems done with D&D. Same with AEG, Atlas, Bastion Press, Fantasy Flight Games (unless they go 4E for Midnight), and the Troll Lords. Margaret Weis Productions is having their Dragonlance license ending, so probably no support there.

Because of this, 4E may be the best edition from a lack of product options.

 

[frankthedm]

I thus I go into broken record mode again: D&D has never been Wizards primary product, & I predict it never will be. Wizards does not need to release a D&D book every month to get paid. They do have other products.

Then Ha$borg looks at the D&D division of wotc and asks "Where is the money from this property?". If the division is not active and profitable, jobs get cut.

 

[Fifth Element]

Yanno....I've been thinking about the "WotC released far less for 3E than TSR did for 2E" and I'm not so sure this is true.

In fact, I think it said so often - nobody is thinking about it critically.

Sure - if you count SKUs - it's less.

Of course, the quote from Wizards refers only to the "number of different items". It makes no claim about page counts or retail value or any other measure. (There may be something else that refers to this, but it is not in th OP).

Given the links provided above, it seems that it very much held true.