Discussion of HARP (as requested by PirateCat)

[lord_banus]

Actually NPCs are really easy to create, even on the fly. It does not require fine tuned customising but does allow it and is very flexible in terms of character creation.

For example if you wanted to create an NPC on the fly, all you need to do is give him base stats of say 50 for non-combatants, add racial mods, add adolescent skill ranks, choose profession and then add an NPC training package with its skill ranks and there you go instant NPC. About 10 minutes on paper or about 2 with the excellent spreadsheet thats available on the HARP site.

This is even a fully fleshed out NPC, You can be even quicker with just giving an NPC max ranks in a few key stats as per the guidelines in the rulebooks.

In terms of rules liter than MERP, HARP combat is smoother, with only one table to consult rather than the two (plus the optional 0 table method). Skill development is simpler and as many people have already said, the magic system is very good and simple.

 

[Matrix Sorcica]

In terms of rules liter than MERP, HARP combat is smoother, with only one table to consult rather than the two (plus the optional 0 table method). Skill development is simpler and as many people have already said, the magic system is very good and simple.

But there are some bugs. I still haven't played the game yet, so please bear with me. But in HARP combat you only have a 2% chance of killing an unarmed Joe Average if you are using a long sword.

No matter how hard you bash him, you can only reach the 100 cap on the crit chart - which doesn't kill anyone. Sure, he might bleed to death, but he won't even drop and be helpless. Only by rolling 99-100 on the hit roll can you exceed the cap (yes, I know there are other ways, but we're talking basic peasant killing here). What gives??

And something else. An adult dragon can carry 40 pounds more than a human before it's encumbered :\ - Where are the rules for loads for bigger creatures?

 

[Rasyr]

In what respects is HARP more rules lite and/or faster than MERP?

Now this is a question that I cannot answer. I have been a RM fan for a long time, but I have never played nor read MERP. Thus, I cannot compare the two in any way...

Are there any plans for a "HARP lite" (a la "Gurps lite")?

Not officially, but I am working on something in my spare time (what little that I can find since I have other projects competing for that time (plus family competing for it as well).

I am going to make it use the completely table-less option that I explained in an earlier post. I am also planning on only having Fighters, Rogues, Mages, and two specific types of Cleric (Clerics of Light and Clerics of Dark). Strip out some of the skills, some of the Talents, a lot of the spells, etc...

It is going to take me a while to accomplish, since it is being done in my spare time like I said, but we will eventually have something workable....

It just looked like it required a lot more fine-tuned customization with respect to different abilities (and spells, etc.). Not necessarily a bad thing, but it does make generating NPCs a major pain, and introduces a lot more variables into the game for the GM to worry about.

Not really. How much detail goes into an NPC depends on how much detail you need for the NPC.

Unless this is a major NPC that needs a lot of detail, you can easily just do as lord_banus suggested and assign stats, and select a few skills to max out in. The skill section contains 2 small tables, one giving the max ranks per level allowed, and the other giving you the bonus for each rank (up to 30 ranks - above that it is +1 per rank).

Most NPCs will not need to be fully fleshed out. On the other hand, this gives lots of options to the players to play exactly the type of character that they want. They are not limited to only certain avenues of learning. A Fighter wants to learn magic? He can! It is more expensive, but he can do it! A Mage wants to learn how to use a sword? or Two Weapon Combo? He can!

That flexibility is HARP's biggest strength, especially when combined with the fact that the rules were kept relatively simple as well.

 

[Rasyr]

But there are some bugs. I still haven't played the game yet, so please bear with me. But in HARP combat you only have a 2% chance of killing an unarmed Joe Average if you are using a long sword.

No matter how hard you bash him, you can only reach the 100 cap on the crit chart - which doesn't kill anyone. Sure, he might bleed to death, but he won't even drop and be helpless. Only by rolling 99-100 on the hit roll can you exceed the cap (yes, I know there are other ways, but we're talking basic peasant killing here). What gives??

Larger weapons have a higher damage cap, and there are Combat Actions that allow you to ignore damage caps. Note that the Combat Actions ARE freely available to anybody who has weapon training (i.e. skill in using a weapon).

Also, as you point out, there IS a chance for some untrained (or not well trained) character to give a death blow, the chance is appropriately small, but it is still there.

And something else. An adult dragon can carry 40 pounds more than a human before it's encumbered :\ - Where are the rules for loads for bigger creatures?

hehe.. The encumbrance rules were designed for medium sized humanoids (i.e. player characters). We really did not consider needing them for Huge creatures. (Simplest method would be to increase encumbrance capacity by a factor of 5 or 10 for each size above Medium).

 

[Rasyr]

And until it becomes second nature, it's a problem that you have to look at the maneuver table for quite some many things. I think a GM screen is a MUST for HARP. Thank you

You might find the following to be useful

http://www.harphq.com/free_downloads/Maloney.PlayerCombatTracker.pdf

There are lots of nifty fan created items available on the HARP website - http://www.harphq.com

 

[lord_banus]

But there are some bugs. I still haven't played the game yet, so please bear with me. But in HARP combat you only have a 2% chance of killing an unarmed Joe Average if you are using a long sword.

No matter how hard you bash him, you can only reach the 100 cap on the crit chart - which doesn't kill anyone. Sure, he might bleed to death, but he won't even drop and be helpless. Only by rolling 99-100 on the hit roll can you exceed the cap (yes, I know there are other ways, but we're talking basic peasant killing here). What gives??

And something else. An adult dragon can carry 40 pounds more than a human before it's encumbered :\ - Where are the rules for loads for bigger creatures?

Thats 2% in a single blow and to die instantly. Killing a peasant is easy if you look at it a little more abstractly. Your average peasant (human) is likely only to have 30 to 50 concussion hits available to him which with only a few decent decent blows will take him out. Add to this bleeding which will kill most people in a matter of a minute. So for example take 3 slash attacks from a first level fighter (+63 OB) which would be quite reasonable to hit the 100 damage cap on most attacks. The damage dealt in total in the 6 seconds would be 87 hits, 9 rounds of stun, bleeds for 6 per round and is at -75 on actions.

Sure its hard to be a one hit wonder but human bodies are more than bags of water. Still killing a peasant is not a drama.

 

[Belegbeth]

Now this is a question that I cannot answer. I have been a RM fan for a long time, but I have never played nor read MERP. Thus, I cannot compare the two in any way....

For a designer of a Rolemaster-compatible system that is lighter on rules and charts, this seems *very* strange. I know that if I were to design a brand new game compatible with Rolemaster, but simpler in nature, I would at least look at the only other system that accomplished this. There is something to be said for learning from other endeavors related to one's project (especially one that was pretty successful in its day, like MERP), as well as avoiding the depressing prospect of working hard to simply reinvent the wheel.

It also renders moot my follow-up question, viz. whether HARP would be compatible with some of the old (but very nice) MERP stuff I still have lying around. But maybe someone else could answer that ... Lord Banus?

Not officially, but I am working on something in my spare time (what little that I can find since I have other projects competing for that time (plus family competing for it as well).

I am going to make it use the completely table-less option that I explained in an earlier post. I am also planning on only having Fighters, Rogues, Mages, and two specific types of Cleric (Clerics of Light and Clerics of Dark). Strip out some of the skills, some of the Talents, a lot of the spells, etc...

It is going to take me a while to accomplish, since it is being done in my spare time like I said, but we will eventually have something workable....

This looks like a VERY good idea -- a nice way to ease people into a new system. I also like the philosophy behind it: a very simply, but customizable, system.

I certainly would be interested in checking something like this out, when/if it becomes available!

 

[Rasyr]

For a designer of a Rolemaster-compatible system that is lighter on rules and charts, this seems *very* strange. I know that if I were to design a brand new game compatible with Rolemaster, but simpler in nature, I would at least look at the only other system that accomplished this. There is something to be said for learning from other endeavors related to one's project (especially one that was pretty successful in its day, like MERP), as well as avoiding the depressing prospect of working hard to simply reinvent the wheel.

From what I have been told, MERP chargen is quite a bit different from HARP chargen. However, it uses a similar resolution mechanics (i.e. just has HARP uses a resolution mechanic that is substantially similar, but not quite the same, as RM in any edition).

As for being successful or not, I cannot really say, other than that I was told that for the last several years of its life MERP was not a money maker (too much of the profit going to TE), and that it was RM that kept the old ICE afloat as long as it did.

This looks like a VERY good idea -- a nice way to ease people into a new system. I also like the philosophy behind it: a very simply, but customizable, system.

I certainly would be interested in checking something like this out, when/if it becomes available!

Then I shall be sure to make its presence known here on the these forums for you once I have it ready (likely a couple of months as I am working on it in my spare time, which is also split with another game that I am in the process of developing).

Ahhh.... the joys of being overworked....

 

[lord_banus]

Belegbeth, I will try and do a comparison of MERP and HARP on the weekend when I have a chance. It has been a while since I touched merp. Seeing as they are both simular to Rolemaster and follow the same base system it should not be too hard to move stats from old MERP resources to HARP. Whether it can be done on the fly or does it need a little work is what I will check out.

 

[lord_banus]

I managed to get a look at the MERP rulebook and heres the comparison:

* More skills in HARP but otherwise a 1-1 mapping of skills, Armour is different though.
* Skill ranks are largely the same, at least at lower levels. Higher levels might be different
* Stat level modifiers are more granulate in HARP. MERP uses multiples of 5 vs HARP 1 though both are +5 at 75 but at 100 HARP is +10 while MERP is +25 so scaling is different.
* HARP Skills use the sum of two Attributes while MERP uses the one.
* Merp gets profession bonuses to skills while HARP makes it easier to buy skill ranks.
* Body Development is quite different from Endurance so hit points are at a different scale.

Personally I think that the skill ranks are fairly compatible and so moving them over on the fly would not be too much of a problem. Magic is very different though.

I'd say that conversion would be easy but non-trivial.