Discussion of Scotley's upcoming 4e Swashbuckler Game

[Lou]

Your DM is way ahead of you. But I had something a little more challenging than goblins in mind.

I did say "practice combat"!!

 

[stonegod]

If an enemy is next to Wilhelm, something has gone terribly wrong.

 

[Insight]

I should point out that Colin, one of our many bards, is the valiant variety. While this makes him a hit with the ladies, it also means he will be in melee a lot.

 

[Lou]

4e rules question

If a power uses the WEAPON identifier, does the attack include the proficiency bonus for the weapon used with the power? I have read that when the power uses the IMPLEMENT identifier, then the magic plus of the implement is added when the implement is a magic weapon and the procifiency bonus is NOT added.

OK, I see PH p. 55-56, that proficiency bonuses are added for WEAPON identifiers. Please let me know if this is wrong.

 

[stonegod]

If a power uses the WEAPON identifier, does the attack include the proficiency bonus for the weapon used with the power? I have read that when the power uses the IMPLEMENT identifier, then the magic plus of the implement is added when the implement is a magic weapon and the procifiency bonus is NOT added.

OK, I see PH p. 55-56, that proficiency bonuses are added for WEAPON identifiers. Please let me know if this is wrong.

Correct. Implements never add a prof bonus, even if a weapon.

 

[Leif]

Correct. Implements never add a prof bonus, even if a weapon.

But, Lou, weapons used as weapons do add the proficiency bonus to the attack roll if the character using the weapon is proficient with it. That bonus is not already figured into the attack power. Your question hit upon one of the quirks of 4E where sometimes what looks for all the world like a weapon is actually an implement. Damn Warlocks and Swordmages!

 

[stonegod]

Damn Warlocks and Swordmages!

And sorcerers. And monks. And bards (sometimes). And paladins (sometimes).

 

[Leif]

And sorcerers. And monks. And bards (sometimes). And paladins (sometimes).

Sheesh! It's worse than I ever imagined. Say, when do Paladins fall in that category? Is that only if the paladin in question has a Holy Avenger?

 

[Lou]

But, Lou, weapons used as weapons do add the proficiency bonus to the attack roll if the character using the weapon is proficient with it. That bonus is not already figured into the attack power. Your question hit upon one of the quirks of 4E where sometimes what looks for all the world like a weapon is actually an implement. Damn Warlocks and Swordmages!

So what I've discovered is that for my swordmage Ali:

Melee Basic Attack with +1 magic long sword: +11 v AC, damage 1d8+8 crit +1d6
Heavy Thrown +1 magic long sword range 5/10 +8 v AC 1d8+3 crit +1d6 (Ali's magic long sword has identifier HEAVY THROWN, thus can be thrown
Basic Ranged Crossbow range 15/30 +6 v AC 1d8+2

Powers with WEAPON are +11 to hit
Powers with IMPLEMENT are +8 to hit

Luring Strike (W) +11 v AC 1d8+1 crit +1d6
Lightning Lure (I) r3 +8 v Fort 1d6+6 crit +1d8
Sword Burst (I) cb1 all +8 v Ref 1d6+6 crit +1d8

My +1 Farbond Spellblade is +1d6 on crits as a weapon and +1d8 on crits as an implement.

 

[stonegod]

Is that only if the paladin in question has a Holy Avenger?

Normally, yes.

Oh, and I forgot assassins. And druids. And psions. And wizards. (The latter 3 for the staff/quarterstaff confusion).