DM-less D&D

I'm with Flexor. What's to de-mystify? DMing involves a lot of brain-wracking, scut-work, and cramped hands from writing small so that you can be the participant most likely to be the target of perjorative attacks at the table. You work your fingers to the bone so that other people can show up at your house, drink your soda, eat your pizza, and have a good time at the expense of your hard work. Is that de-mystified enough for you?
 

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I'm with Flexor. What's to de-mystify? DMing involves a lot of brain-wracking, scut-work, and cramped hands from writing small so that you can be the participant most likely to be the target of perjorative attacks at the table. You work your fingers to the bone so that other people can show up at your house, drink your soda, eat your pizza, and have a good time at the expense of your hard work. Is that de-mystified enough for you?

That extra work is fun, not work.

If it's work, don't do it. No one is paying you to. You don't have to. If you're not having fun, stop. You don't need to be any game's martyr.

If it's fun, if you choose to do it, if you want to do it, you don't get extra brownie points for doing it.

And if you wouldn't play if you didn't do it, don't play. Life's to short to spend it doing things you don't particularly want to do unless you HAVE to do them. D&D is not one of those things that anyone should ever HAVE to do.

DMs are not special because they put in more work. That doesn't give them any special rights or privelege. They still have to do their job as a DM, which means "entertaining the players." They have their own toolset for that (which includes judgement powers), but they do not get put on a pedestal for it.

The players have to do their jobs, too, which means "obeying the DM's jdugements," in part. They don't get put on a pedestal for doing so, either. Nor are they somehow ranked less important or less worthy of a fair stake in the game than the DM.

IMHO, the game would only benefit from the DM becoming a role that EVERYONE at the table fills. Which is kind of the opposite of this "no one at the table fills it" idea that a DM-less session would take. To do that would require some things that I think WotC is currently looking at, like simplifying certain rules or rearranging stat blocks or little things that make the DM's job easier. Shifting some of the responsibility onto the player is a good trend for this. I think it is entirely a good thing to get the DM's off the high horse that the game has tended to put them upon.

The role of "lead storyteller" that a DM fills is still pretty nessecary for the game, I believe, though. Otherwise it's just a bad imitation of some other game (a board game, a videogame, a minis skirmish game, etc.) as far as I can tell.
 

I'm not a storyteller, I'm a referee. ;)

And I don't view the behind the scenes work as unfun. It is a bit more work, but the payoff is worth it when the players tell me they had a great time playing. If a player isn't giving his best or doing well it may affect others, but usually just affects him. If I'm not doing my best it effects everyone.
 

D&D without a DM is like an automobile without engine, like a pond without water, like a banana split without fruit, like booze without alcohol.

It might still be useful, or fun, but a fundamental part is lucking.


I'm all for DDM skirmish games. I think DM-less dungeon crawls are a good idea. But they're no roleplaying games, and they're not D&D!

D&D will never be without its DM.



As for DMs: They're no "better than players" or any crap like this. Sure, they've got to put more time into this, but that doesn't mean it's only their game. A good DM goes the extra mile because he likes being the DM, likes knowing what's going on, likes to tell the story. I had a DM like this. He likes it more to be behind the DM screen than sitting there with a single character sheed in front of him.

If you don't like going the extra mile, don't be the DM. If you only dm because you like to lord over people who're your friends the rest of the time, don't DM.


Don't get me wrong: I'm not saying that the DM has to take crap from players. Only the other day, I booted a player because of his attitude. But the players have rights, too. For one, they have the right to play the game they like. Sure, the DM can say "play it my way or don't play at all!" but what will happen is that they all don't play at all - at least not with him. A game without players is even worse than a game without DM.
 

Flexor said:
And I don't view the behind the scenes work as unfun. It is a bit more work, but the payoff is worth it when the players tell me they had a great time playing. If a player isn't giving his best or doing well it may affect others, but usually just affects him. If I'm not doing my best it effects everyone.

Kae'Yoss said:
They're no "better than players" or any crap like this. Sure, they've got to put more time into this, but that doesn't mean it's only their game. A good DM goes the extra mile because he likes being the DM, likes knowing what's going on, likes to tell the story. I had a DM like this. He likes it more to be behind the DM screen than sitting there with a single character sheed in front of him.

I'm down with all this. And I think that D&D should be striving to make that "extra mile" as short as possible, so that every player can be a DM, too. I'd like that much more than getting rid of the DM.
 

The reason why I dont like the dungeons and dragons basic set and other simliar titles is because it calls itself a board game but its really an RPG. Any game that has a DM is an RPG. On the flip side, this topic. Anygame that doesnt have a DM is a board game. You might add RPG elements and even RPG a bit but without the DM it is what it is.
 


DonTadow said:
Anygame that doesnt have a DM is a board game. You might add RPG elements and even RPG a bit but without the DM it is what it is.

How about Wushu, Universalis, or Polaris? All are RPGs. Two of those are designed to be played without GMs, the third works perfectly well without one, and none of them use boards at all. I believe that also applies to Donjon. Try some new games, man.
 

Who plays the NPCs? I would think a computer game could do a much better job at a random dungeon crawl. I suppose the rule must be that all monsters attack the PCs immediately for no reason, never retreat, never surrender, and never have to choose which spells to use. I don't see the attraction, but if folks find that more entertaining than my DMing, then I'll know it's time to quit.
 

gizmo33 said:
Who plays the NPCs? I would think a computer game could do a much better job at a random dungeon crawl. I suppose the rule must be that all monsters attack the PCs immediately for no reason, never retreat, never surrender, and never have to choose which spells to use. I don't see the attraction, but if folks find that more entertaining than my DMing, then I'll know it's time to quit.

Maybe there are no NPC's other than monsters?
 

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