DnD Game Table- Why doesn't WotC get it?

[Lizard]

I think it would be the height of stupidity to give away a free tool that would allow you to print the same dungeon tiles (albeit on a lower paper stock) as what we sell for $9.95. That was my point to the answer directed at me during the demo although I was more diplomatic when asked.

Unless, of course, it incites people to pay for a monthly subscription. I might pay 10/month for DDI if the feature set was right, but I'm very unlikely to buy 12 sets of $9.95 dungeon tiles. (Currently, I've bought none.)

The current value proposition for DDI isn't very good. It might be worth it for Dragon/Dungeon, but I'd need to be convinced they'll be coming out with content of the same quality *and quantity* as the former print magazine -- something which hasn't been true since they ended in September. Virtual tabletop? Not interested. Online rules access? Interested, but I also resent being asked to pay for what I used to get for free via the SRD, especially since I can't download a copy (legally) for use when I do have my laptop but don't have internet (occurs more often than you'd think). A mapmaking tool might be enough to tip the balance over to 'actually worth the money'.

 

[Colmarr]

In the dungeon builder (the free app) you can use tiles that are preloaded into the application or make your own maps with a combination of drawing tools and either preloaded elements like a stone texture and/or import your own images into the builder.
These can then be exported to the game table.

No wonder they call you THE Rouse. I'm suddenly interested in the virtual tabletop again. Can you, or someone else at Wizards, give us some more information on what the VT will and will not do?

Specifically:

1a. will I be able to draw a room (four walls and a door) freehand (via straight line, circle or rectangle tools) and then "fill" it with a texture (eg. grey stone, beige stone, grass or dirt)?

1b. If the answer to 1a is no, will there be an infinite number of default 1x1 and 2x2 "blocks" that can be used to create plain rooms?

2. will we be able to resize the texture elements of the dungeons tiles that already exist (ie. can I resize the 1x1 square braziers to be 2x2?

3. will I be able to have my secret rooms on the map but unseen to my players until they discover them (or will I have to draw them when they're discovered?

If the answer to those questions is "yes", I'm back baby!

 

[Matthan]

The game table is everything to me. If you were to search out all my posts, you would find me before the announcement of 4E asking for this kind of product and after the announcement being thrilled about it. That's my bias up front. I want this product. I want to get a game with my old buddies and play D&D online.

That said there is one main thing that concerns me about what I'm hearing. I don't know if it's enough to keep me from buying in, but it's there.

Paying for 3D minis feels odd to me and I think that my struggle with it is that I'm paying a subscription to the product. I feel that if I'm paying X dollars a month, that should warrant new content. I'm torn here. I know there is a lot of content (Dragon and Dungeon) that will be generated as part of that subscription, but, call it entitlement if you want, I feel if I'm paying a monthly fee, I should have access to all the bells and whistles of the service.

I don't know what price point I would be comfortable with buying 3D minis. It's different than buying a map pack for Halo or new content for Oblivion. In those cases, the content I buy goes to a game I own and that I can continue to play without any further fees. With 3D minis, my purchase is only good as long as I continue my subscription to DDI. That decreases the value greatly in my eyes. And what if I let my subscription lapse and then renew later, do I have to rebuy the minis? That drives the value down even further.

The only scenario that I feel that I might buy minis is if they came in cheaply priced, large bundles. I'm just not sure what ratio (# of minis to price) that would be to make me a customer. And that's where they're going to have to sell me.

It just frustrates me that the one aspect of the DDI that I wanted the most is the one with the feature that irks me the most.

 

[Colmarr]

The game table is everything to me... That's my bias up front. I want this product. I want to get a game with my old buddies and play D&D online.

I am exactly the same. You and I should be the easiest sell that WotC will ever face, and I think it is telling that we both have serious reservations.

I would be willing to purchase V-minis if the conditions were right. Specifically:

1. There should be a default selection of minis that are automatically available with your subscription or pay-per-use authorisation. I originally wanted that to be "the monsters in the monster manual" but now that I know there are 500+ of them, I retract that. I want 1 representative mini for every "iconic" monster. I don't need a Rust Monster or a Kolyarut because they're just not frequent enough to justify their inclusion, but if there isn't a "free" default orc, skeleton, zombie and goblin mini, I'll be mightily unimpressed.

2. The minis should be purchased individually, not bundled. I don't want to buy a virtual something unless I know I need it. No buying a carrion crawler for an upcoming heroic tier adventure and wondering what to do with the Fiendish T-rex.

3. Purchasing a mini should provide you with unlimited uses of that mini. I'm not going to pay 5 times for 5 uses of the same data (which is all a v-mini is). It doesn't cost WotC extra so I'm not going to pay extra.

4. The minis need to be "persistent". If I let my subscription lapse for 6 months for whatever reason, they better be there waiting for me when I come back.

5. Cost is crucial. V-minis can't be taken with me. They can't be printed off. They can't be given to a friend if I (God forbid) quit D&D. As such, they better be relatively cheap. Assuming all of the above conditions are met, I'd probably pay $1 or $2 per mini for the "commons" such as variant goblinoids and orcs (archers, spearmen etc). WotC will "sell" hordes of these. For the rarer stuff, I'd probably pay up to $5 (say a Pit Fiend or Mind Flayer) or even $10 in exceptional cases (Colossal Red Dragons).

My A$0.02

 

[Scott_Rouse]

I am cross posting to much I will try to post something centralized at WOTC this week.

From here

Here is the D&D Insider Package as a subscriber that we presented at D&D Experience:

- Unlimited access to the rules database (every 4e rule from all books and magazine content)

- Unlimited use of the character creator (3d minis) w/ 50 online save slots and local save

- Unlimited use of the character builder (char sheet) w/ 50 online save slots and local save

- Unlimited use of the D&D game table (play anytime you want 24/7)

- Dragon and Dungeon magazines (daily articles and monthly compiled PDfs) 160 pages of canonized D&D content every month.

As a limited offer subscribers will get:

- A complete set of the 3d minis

- A complete set of 2d and 3d tiles

You can buy more 3d minis later if you want the most deluxe looking dungeon or chose to play with tokens provided in the system (every monster in MM will have a free pre-made token and you can make your own importing custom art into the Game Table)

You can make and import your own maps as I have described in another post in this thread or buy 2d & 3d sets of tiles. You'll also likely get patch sets of tiles as part of your subscription, so the for sale sets would likely be special sets.

Pricing is between $14.95 to $9.95 depending on the commitment.

I happen to think it is a great value but ultimately you can decide if that is worth it to you or not.

 

[hong]

Online rules access? Interested, but I also resent being asked to pay for what I used to get for free via the SRD, especially since I can't download a copy (legally) for use when I do have my laptop but don't have internet (occurs more often than you'd think).

It'll be more than the SRD, actually. The SRD only covered core 3/3.5 and nothing from the splatbooks, whereas this is every 4E book. This is definitely the most enticing bit to me, along with the encounter generator.

 

[broghammerj]

It'll be more than the SRD, actually. The SRD only covered core 3/3.5 and nothing from the splatbooks, whereas this is every 4E book. This is definitely the most enticing bit to me, along with the encounter generator.

Which has me confused as that would seem to directly compete with selling print books of the same material. A disincentive to purchase expansion products.

 

[Fallen Seraph]

I am cross posting to much I will try to post something centralized at WOTC this week.

From here

I am wondering since this is something I have been REALLY hoping for with the DDI those Tokens is there any program or method you may incorporate to allow people to print them out at proper size for use in real-life tabletop?

Like something where you drag and drop the tokens you want onto a white-page and you print out that page with the tokens now on it at the proper size?

 

[marune]

Question for Scott Rouse :

WoTC said "we want to attract more girls in D&D".

WoTC said "10$/month by user (with a year contract)".

For all of us DM with a gf/wife at home that would consider playing, what can you offer ?

 

[hong]

Which has me confused as that would seem to directly compete with selling print books of the same material. A disincentive to purchase expansion products.

You misunderestimate just how much of WotC's bitch I am.