Do bane weapons become epic vs. their foe?

[Otterscrubber]

If I have a +4 weapon bane vs. dragons (or something else), is it considered epic when its bonus goes to +6 against its enemy for purposes of bypassing DR?

 

[Crothian]

I'd say no, but I'm not sure by the rules. I say no because the weapon really isn't epic.

 

[molonel]

The answer is yes. If you look at the definition of Epic DR in either the 3.5 MM or the SRD, it says:

A few very powerful monsters are vulnerable only to epic weapons; that is, magic weapons with at least a +6 enhancement bonus.

Bane is defined thus:

Bane: A bane weapon excels at attacking one type or subtype of creature. Against its designated foe, its effective enhancement bonus is +2 better than its normal enhancement bonus. It deals an extra 2d6 points of damage against the foe.

An Epic weapon, by definition, is one that has an actual enhancement value of +6 or better. If you have a +4 bane weapon, then versus the object of its bane enchantment it is considered an epic weapon and may therefore pierce X/epic DR.

 

[Hypersmurf]

An Epic weapon, by definition, is one that has an actual enhancement value of +6 or better. If you have a +4 bane weapon, then versus the object of its bane enchantment it is considered an epic weapon and may therefore pierce X/epic DR.

That's my reading of it.

-Hyp.

 

[gfunk]

By the rules, yes it would work.

However, I would rule that it would not. This is probably a loophole the designers did not intend.

A +6 weapon is much more expensive than a +4 bane weapon.

 

[Hypersmurf]

A +6 weapon is much more expensive than a +4 bane weapon.

A +6 weapon will beat any Epic DR. A +4 Bane weapon will only beat the Epic DR of a select subset of creatures.

-Hyp.

 

[LGodamus]

I would say the weapon would have to have a "general" +6 enhancement bonus to be epic.... not just an "effective" enhancement bonus

 

[Scion]

With such a limited case, and the rules being so clear, I personally see no problem with just saying that a +6 enhancement no matter how it got there is enough to overcome epic DR.

 

[Hypersmurf]

With such a limited case, and the rules being so clear, I personally see no problem with just saying that a +6 enhancement no matter how it got there is enough to overcome epic DR.

And since a lot of things with Epic DR can throw Dispel Magics around, the +1 Bane weapon with GMW isn't as attractive an option...

-Hyp.

 

[molonel]

Oh, c'mon, people. Lighten up. Stop splitting hairs between "effective" and "general" epic enhancements. That's not in the rules. And I don't think this is a rules loophole, either. Both the bane enchantment and Epic DR, the latter of which is unique to 3.5, are core rules.

Besides, most things that have Epic DR require not one, but two forms of enchantment: Epic and something else. Solars require Epic and unholy. LeShay require Epic and cold iron.

It makes it possible for a non-epic weapon-wielding creature to actual HARM one of these creatures in a substantive way. You can construct a weapon - and it must be deliberately constructed with a specific creature in mind - for a very specific task.

That doesn't seem overpowered or cheesy to me.