Do the PCs ever die in these playtest reports?

[helium3]

That would be one question I'd like answered from the developers in one of those "Sage Advices", myself... In my gaming history, the failures have been just as much fun as the successes. After all, where else did "famous last words" threads & lists have their beginnings?

Ehh. From my experience a high death rate isn't a good thing and is usually the starting point for friction between players. Either because the player with the dead character blames the other players for the death or because the player with the dead character doesn't play smart, has more dead characters than most and starts playing "i don't care any more" characters that are there just to sow chaos.

When I started playing way back in 2001 (I'm such a grognard!!!) I had players that strongly felt that character death should mostly be non-random and heroic, not senseless and stupid. I was really opposed to this at first, but I've come around to their way of thinking. I'm not arguing that character death shouldn't happen. I'm arguing that character death should mostly happen only when the players knowingly charge their characters into sketchy situations.

 

[helium3]

From Wotc_Rodney's blog here:

This was originally posted in this thread where, oddly, no one talks about this bit of info.

We have evidence of two deaths in as many weeks in one campaign. That's fairly lethal.

Thaumaturge.

Weird. I vaguely remember reading that blog post. I've been having a difficult time getting through a lot of what's been posted to the blogs lately. My eyes just start to glaze over and I end up clicking away.

Anyhow, it should be pointed out that the play-test description you're talking about was posted in early December, and with the lag that we know exists the sessions could very well have been played far earlier than that. So, the deaths could have been an artifact of the rules still being sorted out.

Either way, two deaths in two sessions seems like an awfully high rate of attrition to me, even for a standard 3.5 game. For the last half of 2007, our group had a miserable time trudging through Expedition to Castle Ravenloft. Our attrition rate was far lower than that on average (though most of them were packed into the last half of dealing with the Fanes and our one and only foray into the Castle before we filed the whole thing in the circular cabinet) and it still seriously dampened our enthusiasm. Character death is NOT FUN, and with all the talk of stripping out mechanics that are "Un-Fun" I'd be surprised if the Dev's INCREASED the lethality of the game.

 

[mearls]

We haven't had any players die in the playtests, thank goodness. Otherwise, we'd have all sorts of lawsuits on our hands.

More seriously, characters have died in playtests. I've killed a few myself. However, the playtests that are posted are from peoples' home games. If characters aren't dying, it might simply because the DM doesn't want to mess up his story. I do know that Bill left James' paladin with 8 hit points and no healing surges at the end of their last session, so perhaps we'll see reports of a death soon.

I can lay claim to the first PC killed in 4e, and the best part is that a second PC delivered the killing blow. A bugbear strangler popped out from behind a tapestry to garotte the ranger. The fighter/rogue ran to attack the strangler, the bugbear swung the ranger up as a living shield, and one crit later we had a dead ranger.

I've come close to TPKs twice, once in a temple to Vecna and another time in the entry way to a paragon-tier castle in the elemental chaos. Both times some lucky rolls averted disaster. I am notorious for my horrid DM dice rolling luck.

 

[Thaumaturge]

More seriously, characters have died in playtests. <snip>

Interesting. Thanks for the info. Of course, the whole "living shield" thing sounds really neat. Well... not for the dead guy.

Thaumaturge.

 

[Derren]

However, the playtests that are posted are from peoples' home games. .

I guess thats also the reason why we don't see any epic playtests in the blogs as the home games start from level 1.

 

[GnomeWorks]

...amid a knock-down, drag-out fight.

This particular description of combat is getting really, really old.

 

[A'koss]

I can lay claim to the first PC killed in 4e, and the best part is that a second PC delivered the killing blow. A bugbear strangler popped out from behind a tapestry to garotte the ranger. The fighter/rogue ran to attack the strangler, the bugbear swung the ranger up as a living shield, and one crit later we had a dead ranger.

Nice!

Me likey...

Me likey a lot.

 

[helium3]

. . . Interesting Stuff . . .

You probably can't answer this, but on the off chance . . .

Are you guys aiming to change the rate of character death in 4E/make it harder to die a pointless death or should I seriously consider laying off the bong?

I suppose the answer could be yes to both.

 

[ZappoHisbane]

A bugbear strangler popped out from behind a tapestry to garotte the ranger. The fighter/rogue ran to attack the strangler, the bugbear swung the ranger up as a living shield, and one crit later we had a dead ranger.

Oooh, new grapple mechanics??

 

[RodneyThompson]

This particular description of combat is getting really, really old.

Sorry, didn't realize I wasn't allowed to use the phrase twice. Just did a quick search of my blog, and only came up with two instances, but that's just a phrase I use to describe a grueling combat.