Do you have a problem with the distribution of DND skill pionts?

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

1. Why is a dwarf, a person raised in the mountain/underground, unfamiliar with dungeoneering?

2. Why are our characters unfamiliar with the area they are raised in such as knowledge (local)?

Even untrained, you can have "common" knowledge. If you think every dwarf needs to know a bit about dungeoneering make it common knowledge for him, and he can make DC 10 checks even without ranks in the skill.
The same is for local knowledge.
Sometimes you just don´t need to use skills or rolls - just decide if a character does know it. You don´t make knowledge (nature) checks to determine if someone can identify a cow.

3. Why do wizards/clerics who seem to be the educated or learned class get so few skill pionts to spend on knowledge.

You only count the skill points, but in game, both know obviously a lot more - the cleric has some good combat training and he knows how to channel positive (or negative) energy to turn undead and heal (or damage) creatures.
Both know how to cast spells, and in case of a wizard that usually requires intensive study for every spell.

These are problems arising from the skill point distribution/cross class system. Have any of you done anything in your own games to fix this? I'm not really looking for the response of play other games like GURP etc. I want to stay in the framework of the d20 system. We had considered forming four groups of skills and giving everyone the same number of pionts per level, but altering their distribution amongst these categories:

1. Physical skills- jump, climb, swim, etc.

2. Knowledge based/Interaction-Appraise, knowledge, gather information, etc.

3. Perception- Spot, listen, search, etc.

4. Class based skills- Nature would go to ranger and druid. Rogues- well you know the list. Wizard- spellcraft, concentration, etc.

I'm just throwing out ideas and wondering what people think or have done for their game?

I thought about such a system, but I am not sure it will really work. It is difficult to balance, and not a task I would take on lightly. It might be possible.
If you add "Combat Skills" to the list, you might be only a tiny step away from a classless (but not levelless) D&D.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

I've taken the view that skill points represent the areas where a character truly excels over others -- those areas in which no skill points are spent represent "merely average" ability. So I don't have a problem with the skill point distribution -- there's no reason you have to be good at everything.

 

[DragonLancer]

I have no problem with the skills system in D&D. Its all a part of the balance issue. A fighter gets fewer skill points because they get the combat feats and powers. They don't need skill points.

 

[IronWolf]

I really haven't felt the skill system is off base. For classes with fewer skill points they seem to have some other ability/number of feats that makes up for it. The common knowledge aspect people have listed thus far is important to keep in mind. In my opininon when one of my characters chooses to invest skill points in a slightly unusual area for the sake of character history then it adds more flavor when one of his expected high skills suffers somewhat for it. (i.e. who says a character has to be good at *everything*.)

So for me the skill system seems to be working for my needs.

 

[Berandor]

The skill system is designed for generic characters without background. Not all dwarves are master dungeoneerers; some simply live in caverns other people explored and created, living their life whilst brewing, crafting or whatever. Not everybody flying in a plane knows how to fly one.

Dwarven fighters aren't trained to know the ins and outs of dungeoneering; they have a passing familiarity with most things, but the real information only comes to those who seek them - most fighters don't care about oozes any more than whether they can kill them or not. That is the basic assumption of the PHB - no specific background.

That said, you can easily remedy that problem. IMC, I gave my players 4 free skill ranks for background skills (and a bonus regional talent). You might grant them a skill bonus or rank for good backgrounds. YOu might do away with cross-class skils or give each character one (or more) skills to regard as class skills in addition to their normal allotment (like I did with Charisma-skills for sorcerers).

It's not a problem, but merely the fact that D&D is designed for different playing styles, and you might have to make adaptions for it to fully fit your own.

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

It's a good subject for house rules.

I kinda agree with you, so we dumped the X2 cost for cross class skills. You still have the same lower limits for them, but they're cheaper to raise. Seems to allow 'hobby' skills without overshadowing the guys who have the skills as their main 'thing'.

Also consider allowing players to alter their starting skill set a little. For example, I really don't have a problem with a fighter dumping intimidate for diplomacy - don't think it rocks the world too badly - just a different style of doing things.

Perhaps a dwarf could dump Handle Animal and Ride for Knowledge: Dungeoneering and Knowledge: Engineering?

 

[Thanee]

In questions of knowledge, I do not only judge skills, but also race and class, if the skills are not there. That is, a dwarf who was raised in mountain terrain most certainly does have some rudimentary knowledge about that, tho specialist knowledge will only be obtained with the appropriate skills.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Philip]

We're in the middle of a game by now and are having issues with the skill system. As always, I'm looking for help from my fellow EN-Worlders. We are 3rd level characters making our first travels underground and have encountered a number of problems reguarding skills. These are just a few examples of where the system breaks down.

4. Why is the Epic level fighter still unable to spot the clumsy 1st level Rogue hiding in the bushes? Why is the Epic level wizard still unable to walk across a simple ledge?

 

[Thanee]

In case of the fighter, because he or she didn't have the foresight to put some skill points into Spot or pick up a PrC with Spot as a class skill.

In case of the wizard... wait... an epic level wizard walks!? You got to be kidding!

Bye
Thanee

 

[Peskara]

Background skills

Our house rule is: Pick 3 skills at character generation that reflect the character's background, what he did before he became an adventurer, who he was raised by, where he lived, etc. (subject to DM approval of course). These 3 skills are always considered class skills for that character, but you have to put at least 1 skill point in each of them at character generation.