Do you want/are you ready for a D&D 5th edition?

[MoxieFu]

Let me approach the question differently.

If Fourth Edition is indeed superseded by a version which appeases the fans of other editions, I pray to God that Wizards opens up the GSL, so that players who enjoy Fourth Edition now can continue to play it.

Players of other editions are very lucky. Because of the OGL, we can play any edition from OD&D to 3.75 without any limitations. I dread the replacement of 4E, because the current restrictions surrounding it will mean it will wither on the vine.

WotC created the GSL to kill off 3rd party support and thus competition. It was all about getting a larger slice of the pie even if the pie was smaller. By doing this they helped launch Pathfinder and further fragment the market.

One phrase I like to quote for this type of behavior is "being hoisted by his own petard".

 

[TheAuldGrump]

WotC created the GSL to kill off 3rd party support and thus competition. It was all about getting a larger slice of the pie even if the pie was smaller. By doing this they helped launch Pathfinder and further fragment the market.

One phrase I like to quote for this type of behavior is "being hoisted by his own petard".

To be fair, the GSL is also about intellectual property control - folks went far beyond what WotC expected of the OGL, and not always in a good way. (Book of Erotic Fantasy, anyone?)

I think that WotC may have expected the 3PP to line up for the new license, after all, what were they going to do? Resurrect 3.X and have it sell better than the new and improved D&D? Not bloody likely!

If they had truly wanted to kill off 3PP then they would not have bothered revising the GSL, since leaving it as it was would have accomplished exactly that. They wanted the 3PP to channel their energies into the products that WotC wanted them to make.

The Auld Grump

 

[Mark CMG]

Why does it matter the length of each? Isn't it about creating fun and enjoyable games? I've played them all, but started just after AD&D 2e came around. I've loved each iteration of the game since.

Will you be involved in the "playtesting" demos being run at D&DXP?

 

[MoxieFu]

To be fair, the GSL is also about intellectual property control - folks went far beyond what WotC expected of the OGL, and not always in a good way. (Book of Erotic Fantasy, anyone?)

I think that WotC may have expected the 3PP to line up for the new license, after all, what were they going to do? Resurrect 3.X and have it sell better than the new and improved D&D? Not bloody likely!

If they had truly wanted to kill off 3PP then they would not have bothered revising the GSL, since leaving it as it was would have accomplished exactly that. They wanted the 3PP to channel their energies into the products that WotC wanted them to make.

The Auld Grump

But I remember WotC keeping the 3rd parties dangling for months that they would release the GSL, oh any day now, and also charging the vendors just to have a look at it. I have seen anti-competitive behavior in the computer industry.

Maybe I am being cynical in my view, but I have seen these things happen before. It reminds me a lot of the way IBM created the PS/2 line of computers with micro-channel in a bid to take back a larger slice of the market pie. What they managed to accomplish was cede control of the market to their largest competitor (Compaq) and then eventually the clone makers. Now maybe Hasbro forced WotC to do this, I don't know. But to me it makes no difference, the result is the same.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

But I remember WotC keeping the 3rd parties dangling for months that they would release the GSL, oh any day now, and also charging the vendors just to have a look at it. I have seen anti-competitive behavior in the computer industry.

Maybe I am being cynical in my view, but I have seen these things happen before. It reminds me a lot of the way IBM created the PS/2 line of computers with micro-channel in a bid to take back a larger slice of the market pie. What they managed to accomplish was cede control of the market to their largest competitor (Compaq) and then eventually the clone makers. Now maybe Hasbro forced WotC to do this, I don't know. But to me it makes no difference, the result is the same.

I think that there was likely a lot of infighting regarding the nature and limitations of the GSL - for at least one faction you are almost certainly correct.

The GSL has undergone that most brutal of tortures - genesis by committee....

Whether what that committee spawned was viable... I think 4e is already on life support, at least as far as Hasbro is concerned. Rather than reinvigorating the line and recapturing marketshare 'lost' to the 3PP it has instead lost ground to its previous incarnation wearing new duds, with the new threads tailored by one of those self-same 3PPs. That the marketshare wasn't 'lost', but was instead the result of strong growth spurred by the success of the line seems to have been ignored, or went unremarked.

The Auld Grump

 

[Shemeska]

To be fair, the GSL is also about intellectual property control - folks went far beyond what WotC expected of the OGL, and not always in a good way. (Book of Erotic Fantasy, anyone?)

I always wondered about the process of how that went to print, and the reactions inside of WotC (given that one of the authors worked for WotC at the time, and I think one other current or former WotC person at the time was involved in coordinating the project).

 

[MoxieFu]

"The more you tighten your grip Tarkin, the more publishers will slip through your fingers."

Orrrr somthin' like that.

 

[Rogue Agent]

To be fair, the GSL is also about intellectual property control - folks went far beyond what WotC expected of the OGL, and not always in a good way.

Not really. The D20 market did exactly what Ryan Dancey was saying he wanted it to do before 3rd Edition was released.

What changed was the leadership at WotC. The new leadership disliked the OGL and, as a result, they failed to capitalize on it. (They nevertheless benefited from it. But they could have benefited a lot more if they had been smarter.)

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Not really. The D20 market did exactly what Ryan Dancey was saying he wanted it to do before 3rd Edition was released.

What changed was the leadership at WotC. The new leadership disliked the OGL and, as a result, they failed to capitalize on it. (They nevertheless benefited from it. But they could have benefited a lot more if they had been smarter.)

A corporation is only as smart as the stupidest person in chain of command on a given project.

Which may explain a lot about the GSL....

The Auld Grump

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

A corporation is only as smart as the stupidest person in chain of command on a given project.

I'd modify that to "A corporation is only as smart as the stupidest person with real power in chain of command on a given project."