Does Blindsight (ex) see through illusions?

[zlorf]

Im refering to the magic item "Blindfold of True Darkness"
Wearer gains blightsight (MM306) ability out to 30ft and your immune to gaze attacks

eg an illusionary wall

Does echolocation detect that no wall exists?


Cheers
Z

 

[lukelightning]

I'd say that if an illusion has no audible component then you don't "see" it with blindsense or blindsight. If the illusion does (e.g. minor image or major image you sense it and may be fooled by it.

 

[zlorf]

Having a read of Blindsight(ex) again, it really is a catch all sentence, if you actually read the Blindsight (ex) for the monster it will specify what senses it uses to convey blindsight, not neccessary every option under the Blindsight descriptor in the back of the DMG.

So im wondering weather a magic item that is used on the eyes and has see invisibility as
one of it preq's to make would they limit to visual, than to sounds, echolocation etc.
Which would lead me to think illusions would seen as they are.

Cheers
Z

I'd say that if an illusion has no audible component then you don't "see" it with blindsense or blindsight. If the illusion does (e.g. minor image or major image you sense it and may be fooled by it.

 

[zlorf]

I think i'll answer my own question:

If blindsight see's through invis and greater invis both illusions, then you would expect
it to see through the following, blur, mirror image, displacement, slient image <any> image spell, illusionary wall...

The Blindfold of True Darkness for 9000gp, packs a bit of a punch.

Cheers
Z

Im refering to the magic item "Blindfold of True Darkness"
Wearer gains blightsight (MM306) ability out to 30ft and your immune to gaze attacks

eg an illusionary wall

Does echolocation detect that no wall exists?


Cheers
Z

 

[Mistwell]

"A glamer spell changes a subject’s sensory qualities, making it look, feel, taste, smell, or sound like something else, or even seem to disappear."

It's obvious that sight is not the only factor with glamers. A blindfold will not make you see immune to glamers in my opinion.

I also don't think the prerequisite to make the item is necessarily indicative of the items effect.

 

[zlorf]

Hi, my thoughts initially, but your not actually seeing anything when using Blindsight.

I found one monster in the MM which says that Blindsight (ex) makes it invulnerable to gaze attacks, visual effects of spells such as illusions and other attack forms that rely on sight. And that is the Yrthak (p262MM). Hard to argue against.

The Blindfold of True Darkness seems to say that you get the best of all the Blindsight abilities and use which one you want. Where monsters may be limit on how they use there Blindsight. Though i could be reading to much into. Overall is a very powerful item for its cost, apart from not seeing polymorph or alterself its as good as True Seeing.

Cheers
Z

"A glamer spell changes a subject’s sensory qualities, making it look, feel, taste, smell, or sound like something else, or even seem to disappear."

It's obvious that sight is not the only factor with glamers. A blindfold will not make you see immune to glamers in my opinion.

I also don't think the prerequisite to make the item is necessarily indicative of the items effect.

 

[Moon-Lancer]

the counter balance is that you loose your base sight meaning 30 is the maximum you see, ever.

one may beable to argue that archers 35 feet way make you flatt footed to their attack.

 

[Mistwell]

Hi, my thoughts initially, but your not actually seeing anything when using Blindsight.

You are focusing too much on the blindsight power and not enough on the actual context.

Do you still feel things? Do you still taste things? Do you still smell things? Do you still hear things? Then you still are impacted by a glamer. Regardless of other abilities that don't "see" the illusion.

In addition, check out the other illusion categories. Looking again, blindsight would make you immune to ONLY figments, and none of the others:

Pattern - a pattern also affects the minds of those who see it or are caught in it.

Phantasm - A phantasm spell creates a mental image

Shadow - A shadow spell creates something that is partially real from extradimensional energy. Such illusions can have real effects. Damage dealt by a shadow illusion is real.

I found one monster in the MM which says that Blindsight (ex) makes it invulnerable to gaze attacks, visual effects of spells such as illusions and other attack forms that rely on sight. And that is the Yrthak (p262MM). Hard to argue against.

Yes, gaze attacks are sight-only, visual effects are sight-only, and other attack forms that rely on sight are sight only. Glamers are not sight-only. Pretty easy to argue against being immune to glamers because you have a blindfold and blindsight.

The Blindfold of True Darkness seems to say that you get the best of all the Blindsight abilities and use which one you want. Where monsters may be limit on how they use there Blindsight. Though i could be reading to much into. Overall is a very powerful item for its cost, apart from not seeing polymorph or alterself its as good as True Seeing.

Cheers
Z

It's not NEARLY as good as true sight. In addition to not doing most of the cool stuff of true seeing (some of which you mentioned, and also transmutations), it's 30' max. Making an opponent at 31' away effectively invisible to you.

And there is nothing in the text that says you get the benefits without the drawbacks. It grants the same ability that the monsters with blindsight get.

I agree the item is powerful. But lets not give it more power than it already has. It's not true seeing.

 

[zlorf]

For sure, > 30ft away they would be invisible to anyone with the blindfold. The 3.0 version of the Blindfold was 60ft.

Cheers
Z

the counter balance is that you loose your base sight meaning 30 is the maximum you see, ever.

one may beable to argue that archers 35 feet way make you flatt footed to their attack.