Does the Twilight ability stack?

[Xath]

This is about the Twilight armor enhancement from the Book of Exalted Deeds, though I suppose this question could be relevant to other armor enhancements.

Can you get Twilight enchanted onto a armor more than once? (Twilight reduces arcane spell failure by 10%) So if you did it twice, as a +2 enhancement, would it reduce arcane spell failure by 20%? Would they not stack?

If not, why?

 

[Rystil Arden]

In general, the same effect twice does not stack. This would be the case here too unless the GM ruled otherwise out of visions of fully armoured blended-quartz-clad full plate wearers with one level in Spellsword and multiple Twilight enhancements.

If enhancements did stack, then the Acid Resistance armour enhancement, which gives 10 Acid Resistance for 18,000 gold, would make the Improved Acid Resistance armour enhancement obsolete, since it gives 20 Acid Resistance for 42,000 gold (more than the cost of two of the lesser enhancement).

 

[diaglo]

just a guess. but i'd say no.

named bonuses with the same name mostly don't stack. (dodge is the exception).

but that is not to say you can't get a better bonus.

example. a +2 shield and a +2 shield don't stack to give you +4 shield bonus. but you can buy, make, or find a +4 shield.

 

[dagger]

Just make it Mithral Twilight armor.

 

[Sejs]

If not, why?

No, it does not stack.

Can you point to a single instance where a given armor enhancement stacks with additional iterations of itself?

 

[Xath]

If enhancements did stack, then the Acid Resistance armour enhancement, which gives 10 Acid Resistance for 18,000 gold, would make the Improved Acid Resistance armour enhancement obsolete, since it gives 20 Acid Resistance for 42,000 gold (more than the cost of two of the lesser enhancement).

I would assume so for this because it is a monetary enhancement, rather than a magical one. But twilight simply costs a +1 bonus. The more twilights you placed on there, the exponentially more expensive it would get (of course, capping at +5).

Look at the Fortification ability. A Light Ft (+1) gives you 25% protection. Medium Ft (+3) gives 75% protection. That seems to show a 25% increase per point of magical bonus. Of course the full protection is a +5 bonus, so the trend doesn't continue there.

Likewise in the Spell Resistance special ability. Each increment in base price modifier grants an additional +2 to SR.

 

[Rystil Arden]

If they stacked, though, there wouldn't be a need to create those greater versions at all--they would just be wasted space in the book, and everyone would just take Fortification 4 times for a +4 bonus. As others pointed out though, Twilight will stack with Mithral and Blended Quartz. If you're trying to eke out no spell failure on a combat mage character, what you can try is Twilight Blended Quartz and then sneak into the Spellsword PrC from Complete Warrior by way of the Ruathar from Races of the Wild (which inexplicably gives you full casting and all martial proficiencies at first level) for another spell failure reduction. I can't remember the exact reduction on Blended Quartz, but I *think* this gets you Full Plate with no failure.

 

[DM-Rocco]

I would say it doesn't stack offically, but as a sometimes generous DM I might allow it to stack, mainly cause multiple add ons increase the cost. I might also ad an additional +1 on the enhancement making the increase from twilight 10% to twilight 20% equal an enhancement bonus +3. But that is just me.

However, even for a normal mage, I would recommend a Mithril Chain Shirt. For 1,250 gold you get a +4 to AC with no penalty for not being proficient and a big fat zero for spell failure.

If you want more AC, get a large steel mithril shield, now you are at +6 to AC and still no spell faillure.

If you really really want to get another +1 on AC go for celestial armor with twilight, but you will have a 5% chance of spell failure.

Personally I think you are better off with the mithril chain shirt.

I can't figure out what else you would want.

 

[Xath]

It's really a theoretical thing. I've been making a collection of NPCs for fun, and I've been toying with the idea of a warrior/sorcerer who may or may not eventually take Eldritch Knight.

But it got me thinking about "melee mages." There are plenty of spells which require melee touch attacks, or enhance weapons, etc. But with d4 HD, and a lowish dex, how can a mage stand up to being in the heart of melee? He obviously doesn't have the stamina, so he needs a high AC. At higher level, there's enough WBL gold floating around that you can pump up the AC through wondrous items, special materials, and rings.

But say you're 8th level. (4th level fighter/4th level mage) Your character wealth is 27,000gp. Even if you blow the entire thing on Bracers of Armor and a mithril shirt, that's still not going to get you very far. There are feats that will let you wear armor types without spell failure, but you have to already be "immune" to spell failure in light armor (like a bard or warmage). So essentially, you have to suck it up until you have the money to make your character concept work.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Bracers of Armour doesn't stack with a Mithral Shirt. If you have 27,000 gold as a Wizard and you want AC, I suggest taking Craft Arms and Armour yourself and doing the following (assuming you start with 14 Dex):

Craft your own Wondrous Items for +1 natural armour and +2 Dex (~6k)
Buy a Mithral Buckler +4 for +5 shield bonus (~9k)
Buy Mithral Twlight Chain Shirt +3 for +7 armour bonus (~9k)
Buy a Ring of Protection +1 (~2k)

This costs ~26k gold and nets you 27 AC. If you also have Craft Wondrous Item you can get even more. Not to mention if you dip Ruathar to get to Spellsword like I mentioned (since Spellsword gives another 10% spell failure reduction), you can go for a heavier armour--a +1 Twilight Blended Quartz Full Plate is competitively priced with a +3 Twilight Mithral Chain Shirt and gives 2 more AC, though the max dex is iffy.