D&D 5E Does your concern about adding more classes to 5e D&D stem from multiclassing?

[Mind of tempest]

I think that was the intent of the game devs, too. But there are folks on the Internet who seem to base their entire character on one of these exploits, and then attempt that same stunt every round. Because hey, why not?

I've never had to deal with anything quite as egregious as a Roadburn Druid or a CoffeeLock; I'd be surprised if anyone has ever seen one in actual play. But we have had several Hexblade multiclassers and they never seem to stick around. The player(s) always get bored with them and move on after a few levels.

maybe that says something about the combo that is good for damage but is kinda dull?

 

[DEFCON 1]

That's what I thought, too. But according to Reddit?

You "win" D&D every time you score a critical hit, which thanks to your Improved Critical feature will happen 10% of the time, and when it does it will trigger your Great Weapon Master feat and allows you to make a third attack with your two-handed weapon, and since you are a Halfling with the Lucky feat, you can crit-fish for another 19 or 20...

...or you "win" by casting Longstrider and Spike Growth, then Wildshape into an air elemental and grapple your foe and dragging them along the spikes for guaranteed damage (even if the foe is Legendary) and if you use Cunning Action to Dash as a Bonus Action, you can double that damage...and if you can get someone to Haste you, and someone else to Enlarge you, and...

...or you "win" D&D by taking a one-level dip of Druid to get the Goodberry spell, then using your Life Domain power to quadruple the healing potential of each berry, allowing you to heal 40hp of damage with a single 1st level spell slot...

...or you "win" every time you successfully exploit the Warlock's Moon Invocation and the Divine Soul Sorcerer's Greater Restoration spell to get unlimited Sorcerer spell slots...

...etc., etc.

Heh heh... I'm glad I'm not alone with seeing this.

And yet people still get so defensive here on the boards whenever I make the claim that a lot of things talked about here on ENWorld are just people too concerned about trying to "win the board game."

 

[Bill Zebub]

I thought you win at dnd by surviving long enough to get a cool tale?

Nope. It’s all about getting the very last post in epic threads before Morrus locks them. That’s how you win.

 

[jmartkdr2]

why do so many want that class combo?

The more forgiving take: in a world where "use you magic instead of your muscles to swing your sword" is a thing why would a person who magic comes form their conviction not want that? It's just an obvious benefit.

(answer: price is too high, but RAW the price of being a warlock, especially a hexblade, is pretty low.)

 

[Greg K]

Oh, please.

First, it doesn’t have to involve arguments and insults. (And never does in my experience.). It’s more along the lines of a player wants to play the new class, and the only real objection I have is aesthetic, so I have the choice of being a meanie or acquiescing. I would prefer to not have to make that choice.

You were the one that quoted someone mentioning "arguments and insults insults" if you say, "no" to products they bought and replied by stating that people who say that, if you don't like WOTC options you don't have to allow them, are naive or disingeuous. Many of us are not naive or disingenous as we disallow WOTC material dislike. If you had an alternate reason, you should have just listed that rather than being dismissive.

Second, I am a player more often than DM (at least lately) so in those instances I have zero control.

That is a legitimate issue and you should have just stated that. My reply to that is, not all games are meant for every player. You can politely discuss your dislikeiwith the GM. If they still allow the material, the choice is to decide whether you can still enjoy the game. If not, politely excuse yourself. I, personally, have done just this on more than one occasion including having excused myself from the campaign of a boss (whom was also a friend) and joined them on nights when they played Talisman.

Third, it’s as easy (or easier, really) for a DM to allow unofficial content than to forbid official content.

For some DMs that is true, but it is not universal. I both allow third party material and ban offiical material all the time. Been doing it for years. I know several other DMs that do/have done the same as well. It is has never been an issue (well, not since junior high).
At some point, in my opinion, DMs need to learn that it is ok to say, "No" and not feel guilty about it.

 

[Bill Zebub]

You were the one that quoted someone mentioning "arguments and insults insults" if you say, "no" to products they bought and replied by stating that people who say that, if you don't like WOTC options you don't have to allow them, are naive or disingeuous.

Whatever, man. "Just don't use material you don't like" is a bit more complicated than that, and I'd rather not have to deal with it. If anybody wants to call me "selfish" for hoping WotC is slow to add new options, I don't really give a flying $%@#.

 

[Greg K]

I said I don't allow something before and been called a fascist.

Different player I said no and then got hounded for a month every game day about allowing said option (MC hexblade/paladin mid level game).

If a player tried either of those with me, they would be told to find another table. In the second instance, it would have stopped long before a month.

 

[Zardnaar]

If a player tried either of those with me, they would be told to find another table. In the second instance, it would have stopped long before a month.

One was a new player the other was when I wasn't the DM.

Those were some if the worst experiences the other is when sone player who ghas bought a book you're not familiar with and wants to try out XYZ.

Other problems include what book is being used as well eg PHB, xanathars or Tasha's. When new book comes out theres gonna be three lots of rules on races each different to the next.

 

[Minigiant]

Plus magical subclasses for all the non-magical classes.

One thing I always hoped to be core in D&D is a nonmagical fantasy Scholar class. A more upfront and "legal" skill-monkey in comparison to the criminal Rogue.

In battle it would have a dice pool to add to attacks after analyzing opponents. Subclasses would offer easier, faster, and/or different options.

Bladesmith would boost the damage of daggers and swords.
Chemist would boost damage, area, and range of alchemist fire, holy water, and acid vials.
Gunsmiths would boost the damage of crafted firearms and grenades.
Plague Doctors would add and change damage of poisons and healing to potions.


Of course, MCing with rogues and fighters would have to be monitored during the design phase.

 

[dave2008]

I just don't see any reason that having a martial character whose martial abilities are powered by spell slots creates any issue in that context, because what the character is doing is still very mechanically distinct from casting spells. What is important is that what the character is doing, ie their actual actions in game and mechanically, are meaningfully distinct from abilities with a very different thematic flavour.

Well you just described 4e, and we know where that road lead. To be clear, I really liked 4e and the "powers" design. However, I also think it is fun to have different mechanics too.