D&D 5E Don't Throw 5e Away Because of Hasbro

[Imaro]

I'm asking you to compare two monsters you've seen. I'm not asking you to compare the gargoyle to the flumph, since I'm pretty sure we haven't seen its statblock yet.

I just find it weird you're not even willing to read the actual entries.

Why and compare them in what capacity? We were originally talking better books so what is your purpose in wanting me to compare two stat blocks and what am I comparing them to determine?

Ah, so comparing two things we've seen = tea-leaf reading.

No. I am talking books... you are talking about stat blocks... one hasn't been released yet so yes to make statements about the book as a whole is reading tea leaves to me.

But it's nice that you have the money to spend on a slightly different version of monsters you probably already have.

I'm buying Dungeons & Dragons plain and simple because i want and enjoy the game... that means the 3 corebooks are a given (as they are for most anyone who runs the game) the question for me is whether I choose to spend additional money on 3pp books or not. I've looked over TotV and it didn't impress me enough to justify buying their version of the MM '24 monsters. LU I'm actually more interested in...

 

[dave2008]

Serious question: How many of them are genuinely new monsters, and how many are just new versions of existing monsters (like goblin, goblin boss, goblin booyag or however it's spelled)? The only entirely new one I have seen is the... iota? but I admit I haven't seen a table of contents yet.

We don't know. We know the blob of annihilation is new and the Animal Lords are new to 5e. Other than that, we don't know. I imagine some of those are just new variants like the 3 new variant vampire stat blocks.

 

[Micah Sweet]

We don't know. We know the blob of annihilation is new and the Animal Lords are new to 5e. Other than that, we don't know. I imagine some of those are just new variants like the 3 new variant vampire stat blocks.

Of course, the monster itself doesn't have to be a new creature in the fiction for the statblock to be new and useful, but admittedly I tend to be less excited about yet another set of githyanki stats.

 

[Faolyn]

Why and compare them in what capacity? We were originally talking better books so what is your purpose in wanting me to compare two stat blocks and what am I comparing them to determine?

You claimed that SlyFlourish was "disparaging" D&D because they thought that the LU Menagerie looked better.

You claimed it was wrong somehow to say anything bad about the D&D book because it wasn't out yet.

I pointed out, repeatedly, that we can compare statblocks that have been released to already-existing statblocks from various D&D-alike games, or even those of previous editions of D&D.

In fact, there have been several statblocks released, and I can compare them as well.

For some reason, you decided to ignore that in favor of talking about layout.

No. I am talking books... you are talking about stat blocks... one hasn't been released yet so yes to make statements about the book as a whole is reading tea leaves to me.

Yes. I am talking about statblocks, because the book is made up of statblocks. That is practically the only reason to buy a book on monsters. Unless you really like the art for some reason.

(Plus, presumably, it will contain a table of contents and index, and list of monsters by CR, and also, possibly, things like guides on how to make monsters or a repeat of the conditions for ease of reference.)

If the statblocks in one book are more interesting or useful, and have more information, than the statblocks in the other, then I am fully capable of extrapolating that I would find the first book to be more useful.

It's not reading tea leaves, because that's making up stuff out of nothing. What I'm doing looking at all the available data and drawing a conclusion. It's actually rather insulting you liken that to BS.

So far, the conclusion I've drawn on the 5.24 MM is "it looks nice, and I love the art, but I already have the same monsters in multiple formats, and in some of those cases, those monsters have more interesting abilities or have more useful info, so there's no point in buying it, even if I were switching to 5.24, which I'm not."

 

[dave2008]

Yes. I am talking about statblocks, because the book is made up of statblocks. That is practically the only reason to buy a book on monsters. Unless you really like the art for some reason.

That is the only reason I'm buying the 2024 MM (or at least 90% of the reason). In fact, as far as I am concerned it is really the only reason to but any 5e monster book at this point. 5e monsters have been done to death - give me awesome art please!

 

[Imaro]

You claimed that SlyFlourish was "disparaging" D&D because they thought that the LU Menagerie looked better.

No I didn't

You claimed it was wrong somehow to say anything bad about the D&D book because it wasn't out yet.

No I didn't

I pointed out, repeatedly, that we can compare statblocks that have been released to already-existing statblocks from various D&D-alike games, or even those of previous editions of D&D.

Didn't disagree with that but your above statements show me you didn't understand what the initial disagreement between SlyFlourish and I was about.

In fact, there have been several statblocks released, and I can compare them as well.

Yes you can... knock yourself out but that wasn't what was being discussed by SlyFlourish and myself.

For some reason, you decided to ignore that in favor of talking about layout.

Layout is part of judging a book... correct?

Yes. I am talking about statblocks, because the book is made up of statblocks. That is practically the only reason to buy a book on monsters. Unless you really like the art for some reason.

Yet the LU book has alot more than just statblocks in it...

(Plus, presumably, it will contain a table of contents and index, and list of monsters by CR, and also, possibly, things like guides on how to make monsters or a repeat of the conditions for ease of reference.)

All things that would (depending on how well they are done or not) speak to how useable/useful the book is when running a game.

If the statblocks in one book are more interesting or useful, and have more information, than the statblocks in the other, then I am fully capable of extrapolating that I would find the first book to be more useful.

Good for you but nothing in the exchange between myself and SlyFlourish was stated about statblocks specifically.

It's not reading tea leaves, because that's making up stuff out of nothing. What I'm doing looking at all the available data and drawing a conclusion. It's actually rather insulting you liken that to BS.

Me saying the actual books can't be judged on their useablility and/or usefulness in play until they are actually known and possibly used...is...insulting to you. Okay I'm sorry you take my commentary on what I feel is necessary to make that type of judgement as insulting... I guess??

So far, the conclusion I've drawn on the 5.24 MM is "it looks nice, and I love the art, but I already have the same monsters in multiple formats, and in some of those cases, those monsters have more interesting abilities or have more useful info, so there's no point in buying it, even if I were switching to 5.24, which I'm not."

Good for you. I didn't ask for your conclusion on statblocks, the MM or anything else. You've persistently quoted me as you've posted your comments about a back and forth without a full grasp of what the contention was. You've tried to redefine my argument and mis-represented it in the process and now claim I've insulted you because...reasons. I think it's probably best if we just disengage at this point.

 

[CellarHeroes]

Then you should also expect to get called out on the fact that you have no real experience driving car B but made an assertion about that very thing. You have the right to your oppinion... not for the right to it never being questioned or scrutinized... Or is that the acttual argument, that you can not get questioned on how and what evidence you used to arrive at said oppinion? If everyone sets their own burden of proof for asserting something... well then we can all assert whatever we want and never be questioned on it's validity.

I'm pretty much done here.

What if I had owned an earlier model of Car B? On top of that, I had also seen a demonstration of the new model of Car B. I think that would be enough information to make a decision.

 

[Imaro]

What if I had owned an earlier model of Car B? On top of that, I had also seen a demonstration of the new model of Car B. I think that would be enough information to make a decision.

What if you just waited until you drove Car B to make any proclamations about it as a whole... just seems like the simplest and most honest course of action.

 

[Marc Radle]

Tales of the Valiant has it's Monster Vault 2 in kickstarter. That will be new monsters since they are done covering 5e monsters in the SRD with MV1. Plus they have 4 other monster books. Their 3rd campaign builder book 'Dungeons & Ruins' just shipped. Labyrinth will be out around June-ish as well. That will have new subclasses, spells, etc.

I can't say how much new content 5.5e will have, but Kobold Press is running circles around WotC with new content and IMO it's all better quality. WotC will do fine, because it's so big and people don't look for other options. However, if you are looking for something new for 5e, pick what you are looking for from Kobold Press is my $.02.

More than 300 all new monsters in fact!!

And thank you so much for the kind words and the vote of confidence!!

 

[Remathilis]

What if I had owned an earlier model of Car B? On top of that, I had also seen a demonstration of the new model of Car B. I think that would be enough information to make a decision.

What if I decided I didn't like someone because I saw them at a distance and I also knew their dad?