Don't underestimate the Bard

[kenobi65]

Teamwork sucks! I want all glory for MYSELF, baby!!!

-The Gneech ;P

Dear Mr. Gneech,

We regret to inform you that your application for enrollment in the Bardic College has been denied. It is the opinion of the admissions staff that the results of your personality tests indicate that you may be better suited to a career as a solo adventurer. We have included a copy of "EndlessQuest", by Rose Estes, to get you started.

Best wishes in your career.

 

[Fishbone]

Bards make a great 4th. Ditch the rogue, they blow.

 

[Roman]

Dear Mr. Gneech,

We regret to inform you that your application for enrollment in the Bardic College has been denied. It is the opinion of the admissions staff that the results of your personality tests indicate that you may be better suited to a career as a solo adventurer. We have included a copy of "EndlessQuest", by Rose Estes, to get you started.

Best wishes in your career.

Ha, Mr. Admissions officer, who would want to prance about plucking and singing anyway!

Seriously, though, I do not think that bards are at all underpowered, but I still do not tend to play them. This is simply because I cannot get myself conceptually into the role of such a type of character, even though I can do this with every other core class. This is surely the case because of the singing and artsy aspect of the bard.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Yeah, I think this is the basis of most of the gimp comments. From an individual perspective, they are not that strong (outside social situations), but for the party as a whole, they are awesome.

You know, I used to think that this was always true, but in an incredible fluke, my new FtF group's Bard basically single-handedly saved the party's ass through ingenuity and bashing things. When faced with three bat swarms and the vampire who summoned them, he summon-instrumented a violin and burned the end (without dropping it, which would make it vanish). The Wizard got taken out after killing a bat swarm and almost another swarm and the vampire (though the vampire quickly started Fast Healing that damage away), one Druid and the Cleric were both Dominated, and the Dominated Druid Entangled the other Druid. This left the Bard to fight two bat swarms with his improvised burning violin and the vampire with his Cure Light Wounds wand. At one point, he dual-wielded them (without TWF, so with massive penalties) and managed to hit with both by a fluke of luck and the CLW wand's status as a touch attack. In the end, he managed to kill everything left himself--vampire, swarms, and the Druid and Cleric.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

Bards make a great 4th. Ditch the rogue, they blow.

I would not agree that the Rogue blows, but Bard as #4 could easily work. Bringing a third spellcaster into a four person party has some significant advantages. Having a utility guy with some modest healing ability makes pushing the Cleric forward as a 2nd heavy armored PC on the battleline less problematic -- this will sometimes happen whether you have a Rogue or Bard in the party. When you hit middling levels, UMD brings a lot potential flexibility in the magic department.

 

[BryonD]

I would not agree that the Rogue blows, but Bard as #4 could easily work. Bringing a third spellcaster into a four person party has some significant advantages. Having a utility guy with some modest healing ability makes pushing the Cleric forward as a 2nd heavy armored PC on the battleline less problematic -- this will sometimes happen whether you have a Rogue or Bard in the party. When you hit middling levels, UMD brings a lot potential flexibility in the magic department.

I agree with you here.

As I said before, I'm not slamming the bard at all, I'm just pointing out that the OP example amplifies the bard. (Not that you were disputing me there...... )

 

[Mark CMG]

Sorry, its just Song of the Heart, which increases the attack/damage bonus by +1.

I see. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Numion]

Maybe it's better in 3.5E, but in 3.0E one of my players made a gnome bard for Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. I warned that it might not work out so good, but he still wanted to do it, so who was I to stop him.

It was like bringing an army marching band into friggin' Stalingrad! Poor bastard didn't stand a chance.

 

[Firebeetle]

(snip)
The bard's fighting song, with feats from Eberron, gives the party +3 attack/+3 damage. (snip)

Not a complaint, just a shout out since they get slammed a lot as a class.

+3/+3, good for you. That's showing them. I agree with your "shout out" completely. Eberron you say? Which books. You see, WotC designer know the bard class sucks and have been trying ti fix it via a host of supplementary material for years now. The cost if I want to play an effective wizard? The price for a PHB. An effective bard? Well over $200 as per prior posts.

Further, to get your 9th level cool trick, you've had to spend feats and resources. Finally, the bard uses per level pays off, whereas it sucked at lower levels when you needed it most (sorry dudes, I already used bardic music twice today.)

If you were a cleric, you could heal the whole party twice over, spend hordes of undead away, and still deal more damage via spells all while enjoying a better armor bonus to your AC. If you were a wizard you have arcane spell power and versatility. If you're a thief you get all the same skills and more skill points. You're still outclassed. I am NOT saying I want to do any of this, I just want a similar level of power and general cool. Lots of bard players take pride in being able to overcome their handicap. I myself do it, but I'm not happy it is there.

So yes, given supplemental material a 9th level bard can do a trick that's worthwhile. I am happy for you.

 

[sir_ollibolli]

In my Freeport campign we have a fighter, a druid/wizard, a rogue and a bard (with a Cure Light Wounds Wand). Really a great combination. I had to resort to casting "Fear" unto the Fighter to spice things really up. Next will be trip attacks and entangle... The druid calls additional allies with "Summon Nature's Ally" that also benefit from the Bardic Music... The fighter uses it two enhance his Power Attack... and the rogue does that much more damage (as a halfling) to finish off most wounded enemies. And the bard is really worth his money if you count in the rest of the crew of the ship the group owns...