Double Weapon Damage

[Dr Simon]

I have a query about the damage caused by double weapons, which doesn't seem to be addressed in the SRD. It seems fairly fundamental so I'm sure it's turned up here before but as I seem to lack the authority to use the Search function on these boards, please forgive me!

Double weapons are all, by nature, pretty much two-handed, especially if you want to use the 'double' nature of them. Thus, normally, they would get 1.5 x Str modifier to damage.

Now, if you are using them for the 'one-two' double ended strike, for *attack roll* purposes this counts as a one-handed and an off-hand light weapon. If this were carried across to *damage* purposes you'd get x1 Str for one attack and x1/2 Str for another. The rules merely state that a double weapon is 'treated as' a one-handed/light weapon, no mention as to whether this is attack only (the implied meaning) or for everything.

Instinct would say, keep as 2-handed as far as damage goes, otherwise you end up with some wierd calculation whereby you increase attack roll damage in one sense but decrease it in another, rendering the whole concept fairly pointless.

So, any thoughts?

 

[RiTz21]

A double weapon works exactly as using 2 weapons fighting, unless you do not want to use the 'double nature' of it (i.e. sacrifice your 'extra' attack). Same penalties for attack, and same damage bonuses as two-weapon combat. So damage from a double-weapon is using 1x your Str bonus on the first attack, and 0.5x your str bonus on the 'off-hand' attack of the double weapon!

A character can fight with both ends of a double weapon as if fighting with two weapons, but he or she incurs all the normal attack penalties associated with two-weapon combat, just as though the character were wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon.

Double Weapons:
You can use a double weapon to make an extra attack with the off-hand end of the weapon as if you were fighting with two weapons. The penalties apply as if the off-hand end of the weapon were a light weapon.

Hope this helps.
RiTz21

 

[Hypersmurf]

A double weapon works exactly as using 2 weapons fighting, unless you do not want to use the 'double nature' of it (i.e. sacrifice your 'extra' attack).

The paragraph you cited says that you incur the attack penalties associated with two-weapon fighting. Dealing 1.5x Str bonus with a double weapon is not an attack penalty, nor is dealing normal Str bonus with a double weapon an attack penalty... associated with two-weapon fighting or otherwise.

The line you're after - stating that using a double weapon is like using a one-handed or light weapon, without giving any other conditional statement, is only found in the text of the Power Attack feat. If you consider the sentence in Power Attack to be globally applicable, then the character deals 1x/1.5x Str bonus.

If you don't - if you consider that line to only apply to Power Attack - then the weapon is treated as a combination of one-handed and light for two purposes - attack penalties associated with two-weapon fighting, and Power Attack. This means that it's still considered a two-handed weapon for purposes of bonuses to Sunder and Disarm, calculation of Str bonus to damage, eligibility for Weapon Finesse, etc. In this case, the primary end would deal 1.5x Str bonus to damage (since it's a two-handed weapon), and the off-end would deal 1.5x Str bonus to damage (since it's a two-handed weapon), but also .5x Str bonus to damage (since it's an off-hand attack) - a contradiction that the DM would have to resolve.

Personally, I sidestep that contradiction entirely by assuming that the line in Power Attack is globally applicable - fighting with a double weapon is like fighting with a one-handed and light weapon, not merely like with a one-handed and light weapon for purposes of attack penalties associated with two-weapon fighting.

-Hyp.

 

[Dr Simon]

Thanks folks,

That makes sense, I guess. If you are using a double-weapon as a two-handed waepon and forgoing the 'double-ended' attack, then you'd be using both hands to give a powerful chop or thrust.

Attacking using both ends would be more of a quick 'one-two' attack, so I guess you wouldn't be holding the weapon in as much of a power grip, hence damage as if you were wielding two weapons.

Cheers!

 

[RiTz21]

You can check this thread for more help: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20060829a

Cheers!
RiTz21

 

[Dr Simon]

Thanks RiTZ21,

For some reason I didn't think of going to the official site!

This paragraph pretty much seals it:

"When you're limited to the attack action (such as when you must use a move action to get within melee reach of your foe), you can use just one end and wield the weapon in two hands for a little extra damage"

 

[phindar]

I recently played a character who used this fighting style. He fought with an orcish double axe, and would typically use Power Attack on his charge wielding the axe as a two-handed weapon, and then go TWF in subsequent rounds.

Against low AC opponents, I'd usually stick with two-handed Power Attack since that did more damage, against higher AC opponents I'd go with more attacks to increase the chances of hitting. Every so often I'd crit on a full-Power Attack charge, and by gods, that's the sort of thing that makes life worth living.