Down with Darkvision!

[Hussar]

It's pretty sad when the shrooms see better than we do.

I think I could live with a lot of races losing darkvision.

 

[Felix]

I do not like the half-orcs get darkvision. I think they should get low-light (this is one change I have not made).

Because Half-orcs are too-powerful as written?

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

My dislike of darkvision is that it makes no sense that it has a range of 60 feet and then just shuts off. My preference would be to have three levels of vision: normal, low-light and ultra-low light. The ultra low light vision would allow you to see normally with something as simple as the glow of phosphorescent fungi. Complete darkness would still be impossible to see in, and bright light such as a torch would actually be a problem, resulting in penalties for a certain number of rounds until the eyes adjust.

Creatures that live in total darkness all the time should get blindsense.

 

[Technomancer]

None of that, though, really explains why everyone else in the freakin' dungeon needs to be able to see in the darkness perfectly well, making lighting a torch about as obvious as ringing a bell... or why the game should be so very one-sided in this particular respect.

Does it, though? Does a creature that can see you in total darkness see you any better because you have a light source? The SRD says "The presence of light does not spoil darkvision". I would extrapolate that it also doesn't improve darkvision. I would think the amount of light wouldn't make any difference to how well they could see. A creature that can "see" in total darkness (whether they actually see or whether they use some other sense to detect you) can see you just as well (not better) when you are carrying a torch as they can when you are not.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

Does it, though? Does a creature that can see you in total darkness see you any better because you have a light source? The SRD says "The presence of light does not spoil darkvision". I would think the amount of light wouldn't make any difference to how well they could see. A creature that can "see" in total darkness (whether they actually see or whether they use some other sense to detect you) can see you just as well (not better) when you are carrying a torch as they can when you are not.

A lighthouse does not allow the keeper to see ships miles away at night, but ships can see the light from that distance. I think that is why he said lighting a torch is as obvious as ringing a bell. Darkvision does not make it easier to see the light, but it allows creatures with it to move without a light giving away their location while you are broadcasting your own.

 

[frankthedm]

Does it, though? Does a creature that can see you in total darkness see you any better because you have a light source? The SRD says "The presence of light does not spoil darkvision". I would extrapolate that it also doesn't improve darkvision. I would think the amount of light wouldn't make any difference to how well they could see. A creature that can "see" in total darkness (whether they actually see or whether they use some other sense to detect you) can see you just as well (not better) when you are carrying a torch as they can when you are not.

They can now see you from outside the range of their darkvision thanks to your torch.

 

[Raven Crowking]

From personal experience, I can tell you that a lighted match can be seen four miles away on a dark night if there are no obstructions.

 

[Mercule]

I loathe darkvision.

We built a stealth-focused group to go through Return to Temple of Elemental Evil. No half-orcs. It did not go well, despite the group excelling in certain conditions. You can't use stealth and recon when you are practically signally your enemy.

 

[Delta]

I'm with you. I think Darkvision and Immunities are way overused. I was adapting the Giant series 1E modules, and there was some kind of ooze in the frost giant glacier that the giants had marked off as "dangerous." I looked it up, and the thing did cold damage. Utterly useless to do damage to a frost giant.

I assuming you're looking at Level I, area 21, that has the brown mold. Note carefully what the 1E MM says, it doesn't really do cold damage: "If a creature walks within 5' of brown mold, the mold will begin absorbing its body heat -- even from a basically cold blooded creature". In fact, magical cold is the only thing that kills brown mold.

 

[mmu1]

A lighthouse does not allow the keeper to see ships miles away at night, but ships can see the light from that distance. I think that is why he said lighting a torch is as obvious as ringing a bell. Darkvision does not make it easier to see the light, but it allows creatures with it to move without a light giving away their location while you are broadcasting your own.

Right. It not only makes the use of the Hide skill impossible, it even makes you visible when someone doesn't have a direct LOS to you, because the light you hold reflects off of every surface. You announce your presence even before you enter a room or round a corner.

Sort of a weird objection, really, you'd think everyone would have an idea of what it looks like when someone lights a flashlight in a dark room, and experienced times when, in perfect light, he or she overlooked someone close by and obvious that just wasn't doing anything particular to attract attention.