Dragon 301

[Legion]

But no, I do not veiw fencing as sword fighting. I veiw fencing as dancing with swords.

Um, I don't get this. Dancing with swords? So then the purpose of fencing is to dance and create art? I always thought the purpose of fencing was to hit your opponent in the fastest way possible. Have you ever SEEN a real fencing match? Fencers react in 1/12th of a second. Some fights are over that fast. I would personally say that's damn good sword fighting.

 

[Mouseferatu]

I would hazard a guess--and it's just a guess, mind you--that Ghoti is confusing sport fencing, such as seen in the Olympics and some movies, with the real thing. Fencing as a combat style is extremely deadly, and involves just as many tricks and techniques as any other style you might imagine--if not more.

Personally, I think "campaign components" is the single best idea to come out of Dragon in ages. I'm looking forward to many, many more of them in the future.

And while few of my campaigns focus on swashbuckling style settings, I do that often enough, or at least find myself running groups with a single swashbuckler character, that the article will definitely come in handy as more than just interesting reading.

 

[BiggusGeekus@Work]

There is a guy who posts on the Interplay/BIS/Bioware forums who goes by the handle "Gromnir Il Khan". He's apparently a big fencer and has sparred against a lot of other people who used different styles (spear, large sword, etc.) he maintains that fencing is the best one-on-one style out there, it just falls apart when you have lots of opponents.

Of course, you know you've hit a new low in life when you support one fantasy game argument on a messageboard with posts from another fantasy game messageboard.

 

[WizarDru]

But no, I do not veiw fencing as sword fighting. I veiw fencing as dancing with swords.

I do not know if you have seen any of the Sharpe movies, but Major Sharpe is a sword fighter..... He does what ever it takes to win as quickly as possible. In one of the movies he has a duel with a fencer. He charges him and punches him in the head, then goes on to over power the fencer to win.

Well, the first thing is that we're not simply discussing fencing, we're discussing Swashbuckling fencing. As has pointed out, you may be confusing sport fencing with it's combat equivalent, particularly with respect to dueling (which is a very common swashbuckling trope). I can certainly see why you might be disappointed if you saw a title that conjured visions of Agrippa style versus Capella style, or Ni-Ten-Ryu versus Ha-Ken-Do, and instead got a couple of parrying feats. However, I wouldn't see that as a failing of the article, as much as possibly a failure of the marketing of said article.

As for Sharpe...if we're talking about the Sean Bean films....well, he is certainly NOT a sword fighter. He's a rifleman in the Crimean War (and beyond). He's also a rough and tumble fighter, so I could easily beating a court fop in a duel in the 1820s, by which time combat fencing had long since faded as a necessary art of war.

I could just as easily pull out the fight scene from 'Rob Roy' between Tim Roth's character and Liam Neeson's character as an example of the deadliness of even duelist fencing, when a capable opponent is involved. The only reason Roth's character looses the fight is that he lets the fight go on too long.

All that aside, how did you feel about issue #299? Although I was somewhat concerned about the lack of thickness (even though content remained steady), I thought it was a fairly solid issue, as well.

 

[Storm Raven]

As for Sharpe...if we're talking about the Sean Bean films....well, he is certainly NOT a sword fighter. He's a rifleman in the Crimean War (and beyond).

Correction, Sharpe is a soldier in the British Army in the Napoleonic Wars. Primarily in Iberia, but he later makes an appearance at Watrerloo as well.

 

[Tsyr]

You know, I just love it when people say things like "You wanna know why XXXXX sucks? Watch (insert grosely overpayed actor who has you have better-than-even odds on has no experience with whatever XXXXX is) in the movie (Insert random peice of fiction * here) by (Insert director who very well has no clue what XXXXX is like either)! That's why XXXXX sucks!"

That's some realy convincing argueing, I tell ya what...

Though, I guess it's no worse really than the "fencing is the best style of combat eh-vah!" types... who tend to be really arrogant about it to boot.**

*Since I'm not familiar with the work in question, I suppose it's possible it's historical fiction. But that is STILL fiction. IE, "The Patriot", while based on some historical events, was still fiction. Esp. that horrible, horrible fight scene near the end. *retches* Gawds, I reminded myself of it... I must go beat myself with a hammer... The same goes for Pearl Harbor, and many other movies, for that matter.

**Note, I don't mean people who like fencing. I mean people who learn I take kenjitsu and then start a 10-page prepared speach about how I'm wasting my time and they could kick my arse in a half second because everyone knows that fencing is the best fighting style in all the world. Those people irk me in ways I can't even fully explain.

 

[WizarDru]

Correction, Sharpe is a soldier in the British Army in the Napoleonic Wars. Primarily in Iberia, but he later makes an appearance at Watrerloo as well.

Whoops, you're right. I don't know what I was thinking. I thought Napoleonic and typed Crimean. Heh. If Sharpe survived to the Crimean War, he'd be what, 85? I knew he fought all over the peninsula, didn't realize he eventually reached Waterloo. Don't some of the later novels take place in England, after he's retired from being a soldier?

 

[Tsyr]

In my mind, sword fighting is nasty and dirty, maim/kill your opponent as quickly as possible without getting hurt yourself.

The ironic thing is, fencing is very much a "kill your opponenent as quick as you can without getting hurt yourself" style.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

Here's a solution that completely solves the problem:

In every instance where the word "fencing" is used, substitute the word "swordfighting."

The point is, most of these problems wouldn't exist with a little more thought. The mechanics will be the same or similar for fencing and swordfighting anyway, so why not do the easy thing and shift the perspective a bit?

 

[tburdett]

LOL, no kidding. I think Sliced Bread is waaaaay too hyped, myself. I much prefer a good loaf of crusty french bread, sliced myself, to that dough-with-brown-paint-on-the-outside stuff you buy in the store.

You do not slice the bread! You tear it apart with your hands. Some people!